DIY Toner Transfer Paper (cheap and easy))

[Rolf]

I run the iron all the way up and iron for 3+ minutes and it always works well. Will check temp next time and see what the iron runs.

Great! If there are large inconsistencies in temperature requirements we need to know.
So I will start: I use a HP printer and it works great at <3min at 300°F.
We are of cause talking about toner transfer using an iron.

 

[mramos1]

Great! If there are large inconsistencies in temperature requirements we need to know.
So I will start: I use a HP printer and it works great at <3min at 300°F.
We are of cause talking about toner transfer using an iron.

Been doing it that way probably 6 or 7 years. I did try PnP way back, but yielded about the same results. So why spend the money was my thought.

Tried the laminating machine as well, took too many passes when the iron does it in minutes.

 

[Hero999]

The different printers toners fusion temp. must be in the same ballpark, otherwise why would the P-n-P instructions state 300°F +/- 25°F.
Where are you getting your information from?

The and my experience with different printers, the temperature seems to vary quite a bit.
**broken link removed**

 

[Rolf]

The and my experience with different printers, the temperature seems to vary quite a bit.
**broken link removed**

What do you mean by "quite a bit"? Is 300°F =/- 25°F "quite a bit" or just a little bit?
I can't stomach all the ambiguity in information on the Pulsar site, and I only saw one reference to temperature, 275°F. They are in essence jut pushing their laminator sales and we are talking about using an iron.
If it is large difference why don't they publish the fact? In other words the temp. required for each brand of printers.
Time and temperature are major components of this process and we need reliable information to get good repeatable results.

 

[3v0]

Rolf have you seen this page ?


Look for

​

CALIBRATING THE IRON:


This is more useful then a table of toner temperature setting.


3v0

 

[Rolf]

Rolf have you seen this page ?


Look for

​

CALIBRATING THE IRON:


This is more useful then a table of toner temperature setting.


3v0

I looked at it and didn't read past this B.S.:
"The main problem with using an iron is that it is not a well controlled heating device and pressure applied can be a total variable from person to person, so we're going to have you calibrate your iron specifically for your weight! Yes, you are going to be applying your entire body weight to the iron and that will now change the this 'variable' into a 'constant'."

 

[3v0]

Looks like there is more then plenty of BS here too.

I can't stomach all the ambiguity in information on the Pulsar site, and I only saw one reference to temperature, 275°F

Quite a bit of negativity given that you did not bother to scan the rest of the page. Snap to judgment comes to mind.

In the real world it does not much matter if what one writes is true or not. If enough people spread enough bull others will take it as fact.

3v0

 

[tariq7868]

toner used in photocopying took almost double the time in transferring than the toner used in hp P1006 laser printer

 

[Rolf]

toner used in photocopying took almost double the time in transferring than the toner used in hp P1006 laser printer

That is interesting.......

 

[DirtyLude]

To add to the confusion. I crank my iron to the max when using the photo paper, but apparently this is too hot for Pulsar paper and gives me squished lines. I don't know the specific iron temp and I have not tried the Pulsar paper again using lower temps, yet.

So, the useful temperature may not only be based on the toner you are using, but the 'paper' you are using as well.

 

[kchriste]

That makes sense when you think about it. While the iron produces heat, the paper between it and the PCB adds thermal resistance limiting the heat transfer. Then you have the thermal resistance of the "heatsink" (backing paper, counter top etc.) drawing heat away from the PCB and the toner. The balance between these 4 variables (Iron temp, source resistance, sink resistance, and ambient temp) will determine the actual PCB temperature rise.

 

[Rolf]

To add to the confusion. I crank my iron to the max when using the photo paper, but apparently this is too hot for Pulsar paper and gives me squished lines. I don't know the specific iron temp and I have not tried the Pulsar paper again using lower temps, yet.

So, the useful temperature may not only be based on the toner you are using, but the 'paper' you are using as well.

Strange; during my experiments with DIY toner transfer paper I did not notice any of that. I used the same temperature for everything. But I guss there are exceptions to everything.
My transfer to Kodak photo paper that I used was almost impossible to remove unless you boiled it in water.

 

[Rolf]

Looks like there is more then plenty of BS here too.



Quite a bit of negativity given that you did not bother to scan the rest of the page. Snap to judgment comes to mind.

In the real world it does not much matter if what one writes is true or not. If enough people spread enough bull others will take it as fact.

3v0

Temper.... temper, I just stated my honest opinion and you in turn write what sure looks like a personal attack.

 

[3v0]

If you guys bother to read the ******** on franks site you would understand what is going on here.

There is a golden temperature at which the toner gets sticky but will not squish/flow. If you get your iron set to that temperature you can iron all day and press as hard as you can manage and you will not ruin the transfer.

This should hold for all transfers where the toner does not soak into the paper fiber. This should include the glue based DIY stuff.

You should be thanking frank for this information instead of beating him up.

How do you think I should respond to this. He is a friend.

EDIT: Frank started out as a vendor. Just a guy I purchased paper from. But after several phone calls my attitude changed. This guy knows his stuff and is willing to share. You would not be making you knock off if he had not come up with his paper first. Still he is willing to share what he knows. Yet you do your best to drive him away from this forum.

3v0

 

[HarveyH42]

I'd guess that PCB fabrication is the 'thrill' of the hobby for a few, mine comes from the design and build, and ultimately applying power, and seeing the expected results. Occasionally, the unexpected smoke, sparks, and flames are pretty cool too. Etching and drilling a PCB is probably the least favorite part of the process, and usually the most time consuming. Sending off for boards is costly and time consuming, not real practical for hobby work. I use the Pulsar paper and a laminator, and it reduces a lot of the hassles, at a reasonable price.

Frank has a good product, and he spent a lot of time figuring out how to get results. I'm sure there were quite a few failures, before he got his paper where it is today. You should be glad he is willing to share his experience, to help you with your homebrew alternative to his commercial product. He's still going to get some business out of this, he has other related products, and there will still be people like me who don't care to draw out the PCB process anymore than I have to, even if it can be done for free. It still has a time price, and a little added complexity.
Most people just starting out, don't want to spend a lot of money at first, then they are willing to spend a little more to make it quicker and easier. I think that is why Frank is more than willing to help everyone make successful boards, regardless of the paper. He will still draw some new business out of this, even if you can make magazine paper work exactly the same or better than his paper.

 

[DirtyLude]

That makes sense when you think about it. While the iron produces heat, the paper between it and the PCB adds thermal resistance limiting the heat transfer. Then you have the thermal resistance of the "heatsink" (backing paper, counter top etc.) drawing heat away from the PCB and the toner. The balance between these 4 variables (Iron temp, source resistance, sink resistance, and ambient temp) will determine the actual PCB temperature rise.

Definitely there is the case of thermal resistance. Purely subjectively the paper looks very similar in thickness and weight.

Possibly the same characteristics that makes the photo paper stick to the PCB holds everything together rather than letting the toner squish.

EDIT: Frank started out as a vendor. Just a guy I purchased paper from. But after several phone calls my attitude changed. This guy knows his stuff and is willing to share. You would not be making you knock off if he had not come up with his paper first. Still he is willing to share what he knows. Yet you do your best to drive him away from this forum.

3v0

Generally you're pretty good being level headed, but step back and take a breath. Rolf does not represent this forum as a whole and seriously he makes these claims about everything. He told me we were keeping types of photo paper a 'secret'.

 

[3v0]

Generally you're pretty good being level headed, but step back and take a breath. Rolf does not represent this forum as a whole and seriously he makes these claims about everything. He told me we were keeping types of photo paper a 'secret'.

Perhaps I am a bit oversensitive about this. But people often do not know the source validity of even the context much of the time.

I used to call it net think. Truth does not matter much, if people see it they repeat it.

3v0

 

[Rolf]

Perhaps I am a bit oversensitive about this. But people often do not know the source validity of even the context much of the time.

I used to call it net think. Truth does not matter much, if people see it they repeat it.

3v0

Maybe you will understand this:
Don Lancaster wrote in his magazine "Nuts & Volts Magazine" August 1994, and I quote:

"Frank Miller of DynaArt Designs has
elected to go the water soluble route,
similar to ordinary decals. His film
has a coat of a high temperature but
water soluble glue.
You can fake his material by using
premium art store white glue applied
with a windshield wiper blade. But it
is far faster and simpler to use the
genuine article.
As before, the film gets sent
through a suitable laser printer and
the reverse reading toner image is put
down. Also as before, temperature
and pressure is used to bond the toner
to a properly cleaned pc board.
Instead of peeling the backing away
and getting a differential transfer, you
instead soak the board in water. This
releases the glue coating. The backing
sheet floats on away. Eliminating one
source of differential transfers."
(My note: We now know that most white glues don't work)
I did not know most of this when I started this thread. So there we have it, Pulsar's "secret" was compromised a long time ago.

PS. I resent the caractor accenation used by some here, namely using one word quotes out of contexts.
It is really sad when one can't post the the highlights of ones experiments and observations without being the target of malicious accusations.

 

[3v0]

I did not know most of this when I started this thread. So there we have it, Pulsar's "secret" was compromised a long time ago.

Was there ever a secret ? As long as I have been aware of franks paper he has been telling people that it is coated with water soluble starch.

It is not my intent to give you or anyone crap about making the DIY glue paper and I think it is a great idea and effort. It allows people who can not get the pulsar paper to make their own.

If you feel that I attacked you personal I am sorry. My problem was with the non accurate and somewhat ugly statements you made.

I would like to see Frank spend more time here. The sort of statements you made regrading his products will work against that.

3v0

 

[be80be]

Roft It's all a cover up you would think with

Threads: 52,345, Posts: 464,358, Members: 109,391

any thing could be uncovered. Out of 109,391 smart people I bet you could get what you need to no about any thing. And when that happens some one going to get Mad

And one more thing this is not a paper like the Knoxville News Sentinel

It's form Forms have buddy's talk about a buddy's make a buddy mad.

This thread should be only about DIY Toner Transfer Paper (cheap and easy))
And all will be happy
I don't see any thing in the title about Pulsar paper.? I think is said
Cheap easy DIY Toner Transfer Paper.