Shock/Tazer

[tcmtech]

Okay. Heres how we settle this properly.

Everybody that does not think a 200 volts from a capacitor will hurt go and get one.
(around 100uf will work well.) Charge it up to around 200 volts and stick the terminals against yourself. (Any place on your body will do fine.)

Then come back and tell us you honest opinion of what you felt.

I expect some responses!

 

[Hero999]

A 200V capacitor will hurt, just nowhere near as badly as 200VAC.

 

[duffy]

Well, it's an interesting approach, seklum. The mass of the capacitor would be a concern, as well as the mass of whatever you are using for those sticky electrodes (I imagine it's going to take more than a small dab of goo to do the trick).

You would need to fire it with enough velocity that they couldn't bat it out of the way, I think, but the problem here is that the energy from the kinetic impact goes up with the square of the velocity. Seems like there might be an acceptable spot under the curve for the mass of the capacitor vs. the velocity of the impact, however. Need some really small, lightweight, high-capacity, high-voltage capacitors.

Trying to get it to stick and conduct would seem to require some sort of gel, I'm not sure what. It would need to be conductive, of course, but perhaps only a magnitude or so greater than skin; in other words, still much lower than something like copper, so that part seems tractable. It would need to spread out on impact, but not "splatter".

You would need 2 electrodes, and they would have to be kept separate with some distance between them. They need to both make electrical contact on impact, with distance between them - if it hits on one side and sticks and the other electrode is hanging in the breeze it won't work.

Have you got anything on this? I would attack this thing first, seems to be the hard problem here. A fancy trigger and pretty much everything else can wait until you resolve the issues with the projectile's cap and electrodes.

 

[Sceadwian]

Colin, the original poster is using a single capacitor only, how's the capacitor supposed to store AC? It can only store DC.

 

[seklum]

Well, it's an interesting approach, seklum. The mass of the capacitor would be a concern, as well as the mass of whatever you are using for those sticky electrodes (I imagine it's going to take more than a small dab of goo to do the trick).

You would need to fire it with enough velocity that they couldn't bat it out of the way, I think, but the problem here is that the energy from the kinetic impact goes up with the square of the velocity. Seems like there might be an acceptable spot under the curve for the mass of the capacitor vs. the velocity of the impact, however. Need some really small, lightweight, high-capacity, high-voltage capacitors.

Trying to get it to stick and conduct would seem to require some sort of gel, I'm not sure what. It would need to be conductive, of course, but perhaps only a magnitude or so greater than skin; in other words, still much lower than something like copper, so that part seems tractable. It would need to spread out on impact, but not "splatter".

You would need 2 electrodes, and they would have to be kept separate with some distance between them. They need to both make electrical contact on impact, with distance between them - if it hits on one side and sticks and the other electrode is hanging in the breeze it won't work.

Have you got anything on this? I would attack this thing first, seems to be the hard problem here. A fancy trigger and pretty much everything else can wait until you resolve the issues with the projectile's cap and electrodes.

So basically, I have been experimenting somewhat along those lines, I have electrical tape separating the positive and negative leads, and the gel is on each side, also separated by the tape. I uploaded a crude 2d picture of it as an attachment.


As you can see, I think I may have it worked out, but there's a catch. I can't make sure that it lands so that both the positive and negative come into contact with the skin, because I can't control it through the air. I need a way to make it so that no matter what angle it hits at, it discharges into it.

 

[Sceadwian]

Just shoot them with a BB gun, the physical impact of that device over any even moderate distance will be more than the electrical impact itself, that being said turn it into a dart.
I hope your device doesn't actually look like that, because you'll never get it to stick that way. You need flat plates up front to increase possible surface area for contact. Attack a short tube with fins to it or feathers like a tranquilizer round to stabilize it. Also if the person you're shooting at doesn't have exposed skin it won't work, and you would have to hit the DEAD on as regardless of your goo being sticky it's still going to bounce or ricochet off. It'd be easier to turn it into a hand buzzer, lot more practical and safe.

 

[HarveyH42]

So basically, I have been experimenting somewhat along those lines, I have electrical tape separating the positive and negative leads, and the gel is on each side, also separated by the tape. I uploaded a crude 2d picture of it as an attachment.


As you can see, I think I may have it worked out, but there's a catch. I can't make sure that it lands so that both the positive and negative come into contact with the skin, because I can't control it through the air. I need a way to make it so that no matter what angle it hits at, it discharges into it.

You only need to isolate one lead from making contact with the conductive glue. Doesn't really need to stay attached to your victim for long, capacitors discharge very quickly. You could make a dart, or put streamers on.

 

[seklum]

Ok I drew up another one, This one is like a dart.

Tell me if it would work or not, The positive and negative gel is separated by tape, and is kept in with rubber casing. When the dart is thrown, the G forces keep the gel from coming out the front, when it hits someone, the tape is pushed in, and the gel hits the skin and spreads, releasing the charge as the positive and negative connect

 

[dknguyen]

Wouldn't you be more concerned about being hit with the rubber bullet part than the shocking capacitor part of that thing?

 

[seklum]

Wouldn't you be more concerned about being hit with the rubber bullet part than the shocking capacitor part of that thing?

What? ............

 

[tcmtech]

The physical mass of the device moving fast enough for a person to not be able to slap it out of the way is going to make a boo boo!

Build your device and have some one through it at you as hard as they can when your not looking and ready.
Bet it shocks you and hurts a bit even without any power in it!

 

[duffy]

Tell me if it would work or not, The positive and negative gel is separated by tape, and is kept in with rubber casing.

That sure looks promising. You planning some personal revenge or are you going to try and sell it to a legit law enforcement agency? I strongly suggest the latter.

 

[blueroomelectronics]

Are you only going to shoot people without shirts on?

 

[seklum]

The physical mass of the device moving fast enough for a person to not be able to slap it out of the way is going to make a boo boo!

Build your device and have some one through it at you as hard as they can when your not looking and ready.
Bet it shocks you and hurts a bit even without any power in it!

Not really... It weighs waaay less than you might believe.
Not to mention the rubber casing extends farther than the leads, so those won't poke them.

That sure looks promising. You planning some personal revenge or are you going to try and sell it to a legit law enforcement agency? I strongly suggest the latter.

I would sell it, but nobody would buy it lol... All it basically will be when finished is a crude homemade tazer type thing.

Are you only going to shoot people without shirts on?

No, It only has to hit skin, like their neck, or arm.

 

[duffy]

I know how you could make an electric ray gun that works on similar principles, seklum...
Electric ray - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[seklum]

I know how you could make an electric ray gun that works on similar principles, seklum...
Electric ray - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

lol/........

 

[blueroomelectronics]

So you have to be close enough, excellent aim and hope the don't beat you to death afterwards.
It's a very stupid idea.

 

[Sceadwian]

Smack em on the back of the head, it'll hurt more =)

 

[Mike_2545]

How fast do you expect to load/charge that thing?

**broken link removed**

 

[blueroomelectronics]

Taser of the future.
**broken link removed**