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Technology Decision

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chelynn

New Member
Hello,

I am trying to move an excellent concept into a practical application for patent purposes.

I need to decide on a technology; and rather quickly, it seems.

Without divulging too many details, I need the following:

A technology that will find several different types of consumer grade electrical devices but EXCLUDE metal and porcelain.

RF is not advanced enough, x-ray too expensive and with a degree of consumer safety risk.

Ultraviolet, Infrared, or EMF detection, possibly??? Something that can find an electronic footprint even with devices switched in "off mode".

Any direction you can point me would be greatly appreciated.

Blessings,

Cheryl
 

blueroomelectronics

Well-Known Member
So you want help in designing a commercial product that you're going to apply for patent but don't want to tell us any real information.
If you want help you'll have to tell us what it's for.

PS patents are often a waste of money if you don't expect sales of at least $12M
 

Papabravo

Well-Known Member
I concurr with Bill. The fact that you are trying to get a patent reveals that you have no understanding of tecnology or the legal system. In order to get the patent you have to divulge the details. Then companies with far deeper pockets, and much better lawyers will purposely infringe and DARE you to sue to enforce the patent.

While you are wasting your time and precious resources trying to enforce the patent, the infringer is off makeing money and improving on your design.

If you think there are companies out there that will actually pay you for the idea you are sadly and tragically mistaken. There is only one way to monetize an idea. Bring a product to market first, and be prepared to get out quickly if it is successful enough to attract imitators. That's it pure and simple. You can swin against the tide if you want, but you can't say you were not warned.
 

Sceadwian

Banned
Chelynn, also if you're serious about a patent you don't need to have the exact technology in place before you apply for the patent, what you patent is the idea of how your device functions not the technology behind it. In fact applying for a patent that used a specific technology would leave you open to copy cats that figure out how to do it via a slightly different technology.
 

chelynn

New Member
" PapaBravo"said. "The fact that you are trying to get a patent reveals that you have no understanding of tecnology or the legal system."

Interesting. I thought this was a forum where people were interested in helping you, not insulting what you might or might not know. You don't know me and you do not know what I might or might not know--so it is pretty interesting to me that you have made such an assumption, and it is such a negative one.

Fuggedabout it dudes. I'm not naive, nor am I stupid. In five years when I'm a multimillionaire and you are still just building robots in your basement, I'm going to laugh my corn-fed keister off at the likes of all of you...
 

tcmtech

Banned
Most Helpful Member
I have some supposedly great inventions of my own too! However I am more interested in bettering the world than in trying to make myself rich.

I actively put out the more basic information for public domain use. The Grid Tie inverter threads are a very good example. They are getting a constant and surprisingly solid traffic on this forum! :)
I dont know if anyone is building them but at least they are looking! :D

If someone does want to use a design based on my free information they are welcome to it! However if they want the better and more complex system designs they will have to come to me or figure it out for themselves! :p

If they want my research and design information relating to the more efficient and more complex systems, that will be when I get my money. Until then the world is a better place because of my willingness to share.

(With the intention of it being a good source for self advertising of course!) :)
 

blueroomelectronics

Well-Known Member
How can anyone be expected to design something with the scant details you've posted so far. You don't appear to have any idea if it's even possible and we can't help because we have no idea what you're trying to do. You've also offered no indication of compensation for anyone willing to do the design. Is it a paying job? Do you want someone to sign an NDA?

IMO what you're after is impossible to build anyway. Since you want to exclude metal (all metals?)

Here's an article on patents.
http://www.electro-tech-online.com/custompdfs/2009/04/casagpat.pdf
 

blueroomelectronics

Well-Known Member
In five years when I'm a multimillionaire and you are still just building robots in your basement, I'm going to laugh my corn-fed keister off at the likes of all of you...
See you in five years. Don't forget to taunt us when you got those millions rolling in.
 

dknguyen

Well-Known Member
Most Helpful Member
" PapaBravo"said. "The fact that you are trying to get a patent reveals that you have no understanding of tecnology or the legal system."

Interesting. I thought this was a forum where people were interested in helping you, not insulting what you might or might not know. You don't know me and you do not know what I might or might not know--so it is pretty interesting to me that you have made such an assumption, and it is such a negative one.

Fuggedabout it dudes. I'm not naive, nor am I stupid. In five years when I'm a multimillionaire and you are still just building robots in your basement, I'm going to laugh my corn-fed keister off at the likes of all of you...
That's been said before. I'm still waiting. But the thing about getting specific about HOW you do whatever you are trying to do is a bad idea. If you say these two parts are held by screws, I can get around your patent by using glue.

You basically listed a bunch of electromagnetic fields and said that they won't work and then ask us what will work, without telling us what it is you are trying to do save for the electronic footprint bit (whatever you mean by electronic footprint). Surely, you can understand how vague that sounds from our end. You can't expect us not to be a little bit frustrated. Every other patent hopeful who has come has been MORE divulging than you have been and it was still nigh impossible to help them, and then they reacted just as you did.

From your one clue, passive RFID sounds like the only thing, but then you say RF is not advanced enough...whatever that means. How are we supposed to suggest an alternative if we don't know what the shortcoming was? If you want one powered thing to be able to detect another electronic thing that has no power, then the options available to you should be pretty obvious: reflection, magnets (which both pretty much covers everything you just listed), or physical contact. All have crappy range or require direct line of sight since one end is unpowered. But you aren't gonna be able to do any of it without metal...though I am not entirely sure what you meant by that statement either.

To me, it sounds like you want a Star Trek Tricorder that picks up electronic lifesigns instead of biological lifesigns, or something that detects the proximity of tagged equipment. Either way, passive methods suffer from lack of LOS and crappy range.
 
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Papabravo

Well-Known Member
" PapaBravo"said. "The fact that you are trying to get a patent reveals that you have no understanding of tecnology or the legal system."

Interesting. I thought this was a forum where people were interested in helping you, not insulting what you might or might not know. You don't know me and you do not know what I might or might not know--so it is pretty interesting to me that you have made such an assumption, and it is such a negative one.

Fuggedabout it dudes. I'm not naive, nor am I stupid. In five years when I'm a multimillionaire and you are still just building robots in your basement, I'm going to laugh my corn-fed keister off at the likes of all of you...
It is true that I don't know you, but I am vitally interested in helping you. I drew an inference from your original post. I believe that it was a correct inference. I am trying to prevent you from running down the road with stars in your eyes thinking that getting a patent is going to be the equivalent of finding a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. The patent system will exhaust you physically, emotionally, and financially. Don't believe me, believe Don Lancaster.

http://www.electro-tech-online.com/custompdfs/2009/04/casagpat-1.pdf

any involvement whatsoever with the patent system in any
way, shape, or form, is virtually guaranteed to cause you a
monumental long term loss of time, money, and sanity.


Mr. Lancaster is one seriously smart and well respected fellow, and you would do very well to heed his advice.

BTW, I have two patents and neither one of them is worth the paper they are written on. Fortuneately I did not have to bear the expense of getting them.
 
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blueroomelectronics

Well-Known Member
" PapaBravo"said. "The fact that you are trying to get a patent reveals that you have no understanding of tecnology or the legal system."

Interesting. I thought this was a forum where people were interested in helping you, not insulting what you might or might not know. You don't know me and you do not know what I might or might not know--so it is pretty interesting to me that you have made such an assumption, and it is such a negative one.

Fuggedabout it dudes. I'm not naive, nor am I stupid. In five years when I'm a multimillionaire and you are still just building robots in your basement, I'm going to laugh my corn-fed keister off at the likes of all of you...
Rich yet? Keep us posted.
 

shimniok

Member
I just learned about Regimes of Appropriability in my final masters class (ooOOoo look at me aren't I cool? :rolleyes:).

The ability to leverage maximum profit from an innovation is not always (perhaps rarely) guaranteed by a patent. Being first to market with an innovation isn't a guarantee of wealth either.

But fortunately there are some other approaches for making the most of a new invention. Or breakthrough improvement of an existing technology.

Anyway I have no idea what you're asking in the original post, really.

Michael
 

tcmtech

Banned
Most Helpful Member
Anyway I have no idea what you're asking in the original post, really.
Neither do we. Neither do we. :(

And what does Appropriability mean any way?
(I had to cut and paste just to make sure I spelled it correctly.):eek:

Now I can acept 'Appropriability' not being in the spell check! :p
 

shimniok

Member
And what does Appropriability mean any way?
(I had to cut and paste just to make sure I spelled it correctly.):eek:

Now I can acept 'Appropriability' not being in the spell check! :p
heheh, no doubt. It's a stupid phrase made up by business academics to make themselves look smart. Basically it is just the "ability" to "appropriate" profits from an innovation.

The "regime" is the ... circumstances or environment that makes it possible for a company to reap full benefits from its innovations. Patent protection can establish a strong regime meaning others can't sweep in and duplicate the product or make something really similar and steal away business.

Aside from the academic/business speak, some of the concepts were pretty interesting. Really explained for me a lot about the churn in the computer industry over the last 20 years.

Michael
 
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