how to design the window lifter motor continuously running forward and reverse with control of magnetic reed switch

[Nigel Goodwin]

I don't use microcontroller .this for only demo purpose. I need 1-minute delay with simple circuits of components . I hope you can help me out.

Why not a microcontroller?, it will make your project cheaper, faster, and more effective. With an Ardino you could have it totally done in an afternoon - it's a VERY, VERY simple thing to do with a micro.

 

[rjenkinsgb]

Simple method:
Use a CD4060 oscillator & divider IC to produce a slow square wave, eg. around a 2 minute cycle.

Have that output drive a transistor that operates the "up" relay when the output is high.
And, have it operate the "down" relay via a two transistor inverting driver.

Connect the limit switches across the emitter and base of the respective driver transistors so the transistor and relay are shut off at the end of the appropriate up/down motion.

Details of using a 4060 to produce slow square wave outputs:
**broken link removed**

Forward driver at the top of this page:
**broken link removed**

And inverted (reverse) driver here:

The 3.3V in that could be 5V or 12V (the same as the 4060) & the relay supplies 12V, as long as you use appropriate relays etc. and suitable transistors to drive the relays.
Add a 10K base-emitter resistor across the first transistor as well.

 

[Les Jones]

My original idea was to use a NE555 or CD4060 configured to work as a 1 second monostable that was triggered by either limit switch closing. (Via a diode OR gate.) This would remove drive to the relays for 1 second after each limit switch closed.
After seeing rjenkinsgb's post #22 I realised that this was a much better solution.
This is my implementation of his suggestion.

If you are not familiar with "Eagle PCB" IC1P is just the way it shows the power pin connections (8 & 16) of the CD4060.
D3 is to isolate the power to the CD4060 from dips on the 12 volt supply caused by the starting current of the motor.

Edit. I have noticed in the first sentence of this post I said "1 second monostable" . I should have said 1 minute monostable. When I was doing a mental calculation for a suitable oscillator frequency I continued thinking in seconds (Rather than minutes.) so I selected the wrong output from the CD4060. I also made another mistake in thinking the first stage was called Q0. It is called Q1. The result of these two errors means that the output Q14 should be used instead of Q7. (The wire shown on the schematic going to pin 6 of the CD4060 should go to pin 3.)

Les.

 

[arunpandiant24]

My original idea was to use a NE555 or CD4060 configured to work as a 1 second monostable that was triggered by either limit switch closing. (Via a diode OR gate.) This would remove drive to the relays for 1 second after each limit switch closed.
After seeing rjenkinsgb's post #22 I realised that this was a much better solution.
This is my implementation of his suggestion.
View attachment 124740

If you are not familiar with "Eagle PCB" IC1P is just the way it shows the power pin connections (8 & 16) of the CD4060.
D3 is to isolate the power to the CD4060 from dips on the 12 volt supply caused by the starting current of the motor.

Edit. I have noticed in the first sentence of this post I said "1 second monostable" . I should have said 1 minute monostable. When I was doing a mental calculation for a suitable oscillator frequency I continued thinking in seconds (Rather than minutes.) so I selected the wrong output from the CD4060. I also made another mistake in thinking the first stage was called Q0. It is called Q1. The result of these two errors means that the output Q14 should be used instead of Q7. (The wire shown on the schematic going to pin 6 of the CD4060 should go to pin 3.)

Les.

I want to use NE555P for time delay. can you please modify the schematic as per the NE555P IC to meet our requirements

 

[Les Jones]

Why do you want to use a NE555 instead of a CD4060 ? The CD4060 will give much better timing stability than the NE555 for delays of one minute. With the NE555 you will probably use an electrolytic capacitor for timing. (Probably around 10 uF) The tolerance of electrolytic capacitors is typically + 50% , -20%. Their leakage current is much higher than a metal film capacitor and will vary with time and temperature. This will be significant when using a high value timing resistor (About 6 Meg ohms) which will be required for the long delay time of 1 minute. You could use metal film capacitors but these will be much more expensive and much larger.
With the lack of background information this is starting to sound like a school project. Is this the case ?

Les.

 

[arunpandiant24]

Why do you want to use a NE555 instead of a CD4060 ? The CD4060 will give much better timing stability than the NE555 for delays of one minute. With the NE555 you will probably use an electrolytic capacitor for timing. (Probably around 10 uF) The tolerance of electrolytic capacitors is typically + 50% , -20%. Their leakage current is much higher than a metal film capacitor and will vary with time and temperature. This will be significant when using a high value timing resistor (About 6 Meg ohms) which will be required for the long delay time of 1 minute. You could use metal film capacitors but these will be much more expensive and much larger.
With the lack of background information this is starting to sound like a school project. Is this the case ?

Les.

hi,
Thanks for your feedback I will make the circuit and work on it. if I have any doubt I will ask you.

 

[gophert]

Looks like the OP wants two of these boxes trying to push the same switch (his window) to and fro.

 

[arunpandiant24]

My original idea was to use a NE555 or CD4060 configured to work as a 1 second monostable that was triggered by either limit switch closing. (Via a diode OR gate.) This would remove drive to the relays for 1 second after each limit switch closed.
After seeing rjenkinsgb's post #22 I realised that this was a much better solution.
This is my implementation of his suggestion.
View attachment 124740

If you are not familiar with "Eagle PCB" IC1P is just the way it shows the power pin connections (8 & 16) of the CD4060.
D3 is to isolate the power to the CD4060 from dips on the 12 volt supply caused by the starting current of the motor.

Edit. I have noticed in the first sentence of this post I said "1 second monostable" . I should have said 1 minute monostable. When I was doing a mental calculation for a suitable oscillator frequency I continued thinking in seconds (Rather than minutes.) so I selected the wrong output from the CD4060. I also made another mistake in thinking the first stage was called Q0. It is called Q1. The result of these two errors means that the output Q14 should be used instead of Q7. (The wire shown on the schematic going to pin 6 of the CD4060 should go to pin 3.)

Les.

Hi Les,

I’m working on this CD4060 Circuit. I got 1-minute delay on and delay-off is fine.
Consider the following problem :
1, When the power supply on the output getting from Q14 of CD4060, this is the case the window lift up but it’s not. The motor moves little far from the lower limit switch ( if I go manually keep the magnet near to lower limit switch the motor will run, the window goes up, after a stop at the upper limit switch.

2, After 1 minute the output Q14 stop, the window automatically lift down (this is ok).
Please revert back.

 

[Les Jones]

I think the problem is around the mosfet Q3. I don't think it is inverting the output of Q14 on the 4060. This is how I would trace the problem. Position the motor so that neither limit switch is actuated. Disconnect the motor. Power on the circuit. wait until Q14 goes high. Measure the voltage with respect to the supply negative at the gate of Q3 and at the drain of Q3 The gate should be at least +6 volts. (It will probably be close to + 12 volts.) The drain should be close to zero volts. Report the results. It might be useful to add an LED and resistor to each relay coil to show when it is actuated. I suspect that when the window should be going up it is not doing so because both relays are actuated.

Les.

 

[arunpandiant24]

I think the problem is around the mosfet Q3. I don't think it is inverting the output of Q14 on the 4060. This is how I would trace the problem. Position the motor so that neither limit switch is actuated. Disconnect the motor. Power on the circuit. wait until Q14 goes high. Measure the voltage with respect to the supply negative at the gate of Q3 and at the drain of Q3 The gate should be at least +6 volts. (It will probably be close to + 12 volts.) The drain should be close to zero volts. Report the results. It might be useful to add an LED and resistor to each relay coil to show when it is actuated. I suspect that when the window should be going up it is not doing so because both relays are actuated.

Les.

Hi Les,

Your suspicion is correct. because both relays are actuated. I measured the supply negative at Q3 gate and drain is +12v.
Please solve this issue and Thanks for your hard work on this.

Arun

 

[Les Jones]

I don't understand what you have measured when you say "I measured the supply negative at Q3 gate and drain is +12v. "
With neither limit switch actuated and the motor disconnected do the following. With your meter set to the 20 volt DC range connect the black lead from your meter to the supply negative. Connect the red lead from your meter to Q14 on the 4060. Wait for it to go to logic high. (About +12 volts) You now have about 1 minute to do these tests as they must be done whole Q14 is high. connect the red lead from the meter the the gate of Q3 and note the reading. Move the red lead to the drain of Q3 and note the reading. I don't know how you have constructed the circuit but on the assumption that it it is using one of these breadboard things there could be a bad connection so confirm the voltage on Q3 source pin is zero volts. also measure the voltages directly on both ends of R4. A picture of the way you have built the circuit may be helpful. If my guess is right that you mean that there is zero volts on Q3 gate then it is shorted to the supply negative or there is a break in the path between Q14 via R4 to the gate of Q3.

Les.

 

[vu2nan]

Hi Arun,

Here's my version, without any time delay, using only 3 relays.

The motor is braked, after powering off, by shorting its terminals.

Freewheeling diodes and indicator lamps are not shown.

- Nandu.

 

[arunpandiant24]

I don't understand what you have measured when you say "I measured the supply negative at Q3 gate and drain is +12v. "
With neither limit switch actuated and the motor disconnected do the following. With your meter set to the 20 volt DC range connect the black lead from your meter to the supply negative. Connect the red lead from your meter to Q14 on the 4060. Wait for it to go to logic high. (About +12 volts) You now have about 1 minute to do these tests as they must be done whole Q14 is high. connect the red lead from the meter the the gate of Q3 and note the reading. Move the red lead to the drain of Q3 and note the reading. I don't know how you have constructed the circuit but on the assumption that it it is using one of these breadboard things there could be a bad connection so confirm the voltage on Q3 source pin is zero volts. also measure the voltages directly on both ends of R4. A picture of the way you have built the circuit may be helpful. If my guess is right that you mean that there is zero volts on Q3 gate then it is shorted to the supply negative or there is a break in the path between Q14 via R4 to the gate of Q3.

Les.

Hi Les,
first of all sorry for the delay report.
Q3 gate is 12.05 volts.
Q3 drain is 12.05 volts (during output Q14 goes high its about 12.21 volts).
and plz find the attached file for better understanding.
note: I checked the circuit connection I feel its fine .the problem occured on the motor moves down function.

Arun.

 

[Les Jones]

I think Q3 is faulty. Probably with a gate to drain short.

Les.

 

[arunpandiant24]

I think Q3 is faulty. Probably with a gate to drain short.

Les.

Hi Les,
Your prediction is correct. it is working when i replace the Q3 component. Thank you so much for your support.

Arun.

 

[arunpandiant24]

Thanks to all for your support.