How To Build An Ionic Breeze

[Nigel Goodwin]

A reasonably High level Will Distroy a Condom in 15 Minutes.

So that's why there's all this fuss about the 'hole in the condom layer'? :lol:

 

[audioguru]

I have a very small fan blowing on me right now. It is powered by two little AAA cells. I am using 850mA/hr Ni-MH cells and they become quite warm after a few minutes. Since they last only about a half-hour, I measured the current: 1.2A at 2.4V! The thingy is blowing hot air!

I smell either ozone coming from its sparking brushes, or Chinese varnish burning. :lol:

 

[Oznog]

Ozone Causes Cancer.

The evidence of this is poor.
Oxygen is virtually all found as O2- two oxygen atoms linked together with a strong bond. Ozone is O3 and it doesn't like to stay that way, it's got a significant reactive energy potential wide open, like a big magnet waiting to stick to something.

It can react with other chemicals (or the lining of your lungs) more readily than oxygen. It can also break down into O2 and a single unbonded O (called a free radical). The free radical is even more willing to react with anything it comes across.

Its main established effect is just irritating the lungs and eyes and aggravating existing repiratory disorders. Getting sufficient quantities into the body then have them penetrate the cell wall and damage DNA or make chemicasl that do is a bit of a stretch, it has a short lifespan.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozone

 

[chemelec]

I Somewhat agree, But who really knows what causes Cancer.
I think it has a lot to do with a particular persons "Susceptability to getting cancer". Or maybe it just Helps an existing cancer grow faster.

However, When you Generate Ozone by arcing or by Corona discharge or by Ultra Violet light, You also create Oxides of other gases that are in the surrounding air.

The WORST One is Nitrogen being converted to Nitrous Oxide. And if you also have a High Humidity, this partly turns into Hydrochloric Acid.

Not Very good for Breathing.

Not Mentioning this Company's name, But there is/was a manufacturer of a Simular type of Air Cleaner in the USA that got Sued Many times and lost.
It had a Particularly High Ozone Output. When it was first used in a house, the ozone would Deplete faster than it was generated, But as the Bacteria became Less and Less, The Ozone would than build up to Toxic Levels, Causing Serious Medical Problems in the residents. This was Also partly related to the generation of Nitrous Oxide.

 

[audioguru]

This was Also partly related to the generation of Nitrous Oxide.

Isn't that "laughing gas"? :?: :lol:
The power booster for teenagers' cars? :?: :lol:

 

[chemelec]

Yes, But Not very Pure.

Breathing the combination of all the gas's Produced can be Quite Toxic.

I have smelled it for very shot periods, but I Definately wouldn't chance doing it for any longer than necessary.

 

[Halogrunt1234]

anyway, back to the ionic breeze, yes it is an overpriced piece of crap that uses professional sounding concepts to try to make itself look like a breakthrough quality product. cases in point: scientifically vauge explanations, evenly spaced and unnumbered graphs, "patented Xenion technology!", and then it claims to use up very little power.

I alslo found a kit in an advertisement in Nuts & Volts magazine that simulated the exact same effect described, selling for about 20 to 60 bucks (not sure of exact price).

just like that Cold Heat cordless soldering iron, this sounds like an overpriced mediocrily performing piece of crap.

(oh yeah. ozone smells quite good )

 

[i_build_stuff]

Chemelec's site actually has a nice write-up on building these things, complete with ozone warnings and info on proper plate construction:

**broken link removed**

It's not really the voltage that causes ionization / ozone production, but the electric field intensity. This depends on the voltage as well as the geometry of your setup. The calculations can be pretty nasty (Poisson's equation might give a close estimate), but experimenting with different wire sizes / distances / voltages could lead to a workable design more quickly...

[EDIT] Chemelec, did you ever look at the HV trigger xfmr's from Mouser Electronics that I mentioned on your forum? They look exactly like the ones in your pictures, and only cost about 3 bucks...

 

[RHJAX]

patents for ionic breeze

There are two US patents on the ionic breeze technology: 4789801 and 6176977. There is a lot in detailed info in the patents and I think one could build one from them. Go to the www.uspto.gov then patents -> search -> patent number -> enter the number. To get the images (recomended) click images (Note:you may have to get the active x control installed, just follow the help under images.) Have fun and let us know if you get anywhere with it.

 

[AllVol]

From "How things work - The Physics of Everyday Life", Louis A. Bloomfield, University of Virginia, USA:

"Household ion generators also remove dust and smoke from room air. These machines resemble electrostatic precipitators but have no internal collecting plates. While they still use corona discharges to charge passing dust grains, they don't attempt to remove the dust from the air. Instead, they let those electrically charged particles, or ions, drift around the room on their own.

"The ions don't drift long because they're attracted to neutral surfaces. A neutral surface contains countless electric charges, and a charged dust grain will attract the surface's opposite charges while repelling its like charges. Because of the forces, the surface's positive and negative charges shift slightly in opposite directions, and the surface becomes electrically polarized. A polarized object is neutral overall but has a positively charged end and a negatively charged end.

"The dust grain and the surface it polarizes attract one another and stick. You can see this effect by charging a toy balloon in your hair and then touching it to a wall. The balloon's charge will polarize the wall, and the two will cling to one another. Thus an ion generator removes particles from the air by sticking them to surfaces in the room. This method is cheap and effective, but the dust ends up decorating the walls and furniture, a problem unless you're fond of the color gray."

See?

AllVol

 

[F0rmatR]

Ozone?

(oh yeah. ozone smells quite good )

This being my first post of many I hope. I will try to explain how ions are made and ozone is made. But today I will ask you all about lightning and UV rays.
The sun, gives us UV rays that prduce ozone. Lightning, a very large spark producing ozone. The sun in the summer time can produce more ozone then it does in the winter, longer days in summer, and this helps to heal the ozone layer. Now how many people hate the smell you get after a lightning storm? You step outside after the rain has stopped and you take a deep breath of fresh air. lol, smells bad eh? So I guess what I am saying is the ozone in the air is mother natures way of disinfecting the air we breath. So by adding just a hint of ozone to the air we breath in our homes is not a bad thing at all. The ions you want to make will be charged negitive. Now not all of us know that electicity flows from negitive to positive. The reason we feel a breeze is the negitive ions are headed to a more positive surface, charging the air with it. So now all we need to do is put something more positive in its path so the negitive charged dust particals have somewhere to go other than on your walls and floor. Thus a collector. You could put these collector plates close together but how would you clean the dust and other crap off the plates?
I use to clean the "Smoke Eater" line of air cleaners. We had to put the collector plates in a tub of water and cleaning product. Gross stuff come out of these suckers. These plates are about 1/4" apart. There is no way to get a cleaning rag in the gap. So if you make your collector with 3/4" gap, you could get a brush or cleaning rag in there without too much problem. The little ozone that is made while making ions is just a big plus in my book as it will help to disinfect the house as well.

Well that is all I have to say today. I hope to be back with more FACTs later.

 

[F0rmatR]

I have some interesting links that covers ions and ozone.

**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**

Hope this helps

 

[catcat]

I read that:
IONIC AIR CLEANER = OZONE = BAD

 

[Oznog]

Ionic air cleaners are tremendously effective at removing large SMOKE particles from the air. They have no effect on cleaning allergens, chemicals, etc. I'm not sure they're effective at removing all the components of cigarette smoke either, maybe just visible ones.

You're drawing some unscientific conclusions about ozone. Storms are neat and the ozone smells neat under those circumstances, probably because of the association with storms and how clean the outdoors feels later. Ozone doesn't make the outdoors clean, it's mostly the rain. That "good feeling" doesn't mean it's a good thing, some people like the smell of cigarette smoke. Ozone will oxidize many organics which means it destroys some microorganisms in the air (of which there is usually no risk to anybody) but also damages lung tissue and irritates eyes equally well. It is very undesirable to make ozone in inhabited rooms.

 

[BeeBop]

Just thought I would add two cents here: falling water generates free ions. I don't know how this is explained, but it does make sense. A small indoor waterfall will also leave your home smelling fresh. This is a safe way to do it, and the 'nice after rain smell' is the same as the smell which comes from a rainstorm, photocopier, or those little ionic wind machines. (I have a few of them, as they are really cheap here ~$20 I wouldn't pay more!) They work well with dust (and there is a lot here so they help a lot.)
I agree with Oz, that ozone does oxidize, and can verify that some materials decompose VERY quickly in the presence of ozone. I think that is the danger associated with respiration - the oxidization of lung tissue. Ozone is also produced by UV light, and there exist cleaners which use UV in a sealed container to clean contaminants from both air and water.
If it is clean pure air you want, why not use a combination of ion generation and carbon or HEPA filtering?
Regards,
Robert

 

[F0rmatR]

I am talking about the little bit of ozone that is made when you make ions. In order for ozone to burn your lungs and eyes and nose there has to be alot of ozone in the air. If all I wanted to do was to disinfect a bathroom I would use a ozone generator and leave the room. To kill mold and mildew we need high levels of ozone to do the trick. So Get out of the room that is being disinfected. Ozone is one of the most powerful oxidizers known to man. So why expose yourself to these high levels? Just I hint of gasoline is not a bad smell and i don't think it will hurt you,but I don't think it would be a good idea to take a bath in it.
Now maybe we should just seal ourselves inside where there is no sunlight. As we ALL know that the sun causes canser.
I think I had better stop now....
No matter how hard we try to clean up the air in our houses, we will never replace good ole mother nature. but we can control the dust and smoke and mildew by building a small ionizer. after all we are cleaning 3000 square ft, not 3000 square miles.
nuff said

ttfn