Continue to Site

Welcome to our site!

Electro Tech is an online community (with over 170,000 members) who enjoy talking about and building electronic circuits, projects and gadgets. To participate you need to register. Registration is free. Click here to register now.

  • Welcome to our site! Electro Tech is an online community (with over 170,000 members) who enjoy talking about and building electronic circuits, projects and gadgets. To participate you need to register. Registration is free. Click here to register now.

Solenoids, right for me?

Status
Not open for further replies.

Fafhrdd

New Member
Hello everyone.

I am new to robotics and how to get all the parts to work together to do what I want them to do. So please be easy on me, and I am sorry for any amount of ignorance on my part.

I am trying to get a part or device that will move up and down, when I want it or how fast I want it. I am not talking about the speed in which it goes up and down but the timing of when it goes up and down.

It will not support any weight, so I don't need something that can hold/lift 1 or more pounds. It just needs to move up and down. The smaller the better and does not need to have a large stroke or whatever it's called, just a few inch stroke (1 to 2 inches at most is needed).

I heard about Solenoids and single action or push/pull devices but I don't know if I need a push pull (since I want it to go up and down) or what not.

Any help would be greatly loved!!!
 
Sound like a solenoid is a possible solution.

What are you trying to build?
 
With a solenoid the "stroke" is how far it travels so how much stroke did you want?

Ron
 
Okay great, if a solenoid would work where would I look to get one? I did a google search and I get all these larger heavy duty ones that can lift 90 and up pounds or something like that.

As far as the stroke.... I only need something an inch.

It may sound stupid but I am only going to need it to press a button. So as you can imagine, it is not going to be powerful and it does not have to move up and down that far, only enough to release/unpress the button (1/8th of an inch).
 
Since you do not show a location it is difficult to suggest a source. However, for example here in the US I would likely start with McMaster Carr Supply or one of my electronic suppliers. Next, since you only want to push a button if this is an electrical circuit possibly you could consider using electronics rather than a mechanical solenoid?

Another possibility for a very light application like you have would be to be to build your own solenoid. A solenoid is not a very complex device. Some wire, a spring for return action and a bobbin or two or form.

I am sorry, it also has to be electronic... I heard Solenoids are electronic?

A solenoid is an electro mechanical device, not really electronic by definition. Depends on how we define it I guess.

Ron
 
Last edited:
Sorry about that, I am from Maryland (USA). I will check out McMaster Carr Supply.

I may want to go 100% electronic in the future but as of right now a phyisical button press would be best for me.

Is there any resoures out there how to make a solenoid? I may be interested in going that route.

I want to thank everyone for the help so far!
 
OK, give McMaster Carr a lookie and use their web search functions. Currently I am away from home so I don't have access to my normal resources. You may want to give this a read for the basics of making a simple solenoid.

Ron
 
I did find that section and have been looking at it... and I have a few questions...

Again, please pardon my ignorance in this matter, trying to learn here. I am looking at the "Sealed Linear Solenoids". What type would I be going for here? Pull or Push? What is the difference? Does pull stay out and then go in? Does push stay in and goes out?

Also I am looking at something that will press the button every 5 minutes or so and I am confused when they say that the Intermittent-duty models have a 10% duty cycle with a maximum "on" time of 1 minute. What is a duty cycle and max "on" time mean?

Can these perform the same function over and over again (press the button) every 5 minutes or so for several hours at a time?
 
Push = pushes/extends when energized, relies upon actuation force from the switch or a spring (or gravity) to retract.

Pull = pulls/retracts when engergized, relies upon a spring (or gravity) to extend.

Duty cycle = percentage of time energized subject to a maximum of 1 minute energized at a time.

Several hours? We run our 24V continuous duty solenoids at 28V and 50% duty for 100,000 cycles per day for weeks at a time. I think we must have 10 million cycles on each of twenty by now. I think I cleaned them once but that's been it.
 
That is awesome!!! I think this is the perfect thing for me!

Now my question (again I will show my ignorance on this topic), I am going to order the push 12V solenoids for my project, I am assuming I will need some kind of chip that will apply the 12V of power when I want it to.

What parts/chips would I need to get that would allow me to program it to apply the required 12 volts to the solendoids for a few seconds and then stop the volts for X amount of time before applying the few seconds of power again and repeating the loop?

Again, you guys are helping me out SO much, I thank you for your time, you guys are a life saver!!!
 
OK, real quick here before I fall asleep. :)

A continuous duty is a solenoid that can maintain an on state indefinitely. When we say intermittent with a specified duty cycle what we are saying is if for example we have an on time of 1 nin with a 10% duty cycle it needs an off time of 9 min. With a 1 second button push, you would want a 9 second off time. In your case you only want a momentary button press (maybe 1 second on time) then a long period of maybe 5 min off before another button press.

Sealed linear just means the solenoid has a linear stroke and the coil is sealed in a can. The coil is not exposed. I believe everything else has been well covered. :)

Ron
 
Last edited:
Thank you!!!

Okay now my question, what do I need to make these work? I know I am going to need a battery pack of some kind and something that will control the voltage to the solenoid?
 
The solenoid will have a coil voltage and that is the voltage required to make it work. If this solenoid is to be battery powered it will need a DC coil, typically 12 or 24 volts but there are other DC voltages. Additionally it is a common practice to place a diode across a DC solenoid's coil, known commonly as a "flyback" diode. As to what controls the voltage to the solenoid, it can be as simple as a N/O (Normally Open) push button switch, it really depends on the application.

Ron
 
Thanks again for the reply! You are a wealth of knowledge...

I would be buying the 12 volt one, and I would like it to run for around 12 hours or so without me having to press it (of course).

So I need something I can configure or program. Something that would run forever (until I turn it off). So I would need to loop something that would allow the solenoid to recieve the 12 volts of power for like a second (to press the button) and turn it off for like 5 minutes (go back up and wait 5 minutes).

I hope I am making sense...

I can do the research but I need to figure how what I need to get the job done, because I have no idea were to start....

THANKS AGAIN!
 
I know this may be a strange question, is there access to the button itself, as in can you get to the wires of the button? If you can a simple Relay may be you best option.

As for timing, I use these often ( much cheaper ones out there , not sure how much power your project needs to switch ) But you connect up the relay dial in the time you want and set it for repeat, and it will cycle for you.

**broken link removed**

Like I said, if you have the option to get to the wires or pins of the switch it will make life allot easier for you.
 
OK, back around post #7 you mentioned:
I may want to go 100% electronic in the future but as of right now a phyisical button press would be best for me.

That is what DJDAudio was also getting at, just as I questioned it also. You want an electro mechanical solution which is using a solenoid to press the button. Just making sure here before we beat solenoids to death. :)

Now depending on the project or better put what you want to spend you have a few options. You can buy or build the timer that drives the solenoid. You want a repeat cycle timer where it is on about a second and off for about 5 min. then repeats that on / off cycle. I don't believe the timer DJDAudio linked to is not quite what you want as it is a delay on make type timer as in:

The A1M Series is a Delay On Make time
delay relay featuring easy to program multiple
time ranges and digital time selection
with extremely high accuracy and repeatability.

Operating Logic: Upon application of voltage
to the input terminals, the time delay is
initiated. At the end of the preset time delay,
the relay coil is energized and the contacts
transfer. Reset is accomplished by the
removal of input voltage.

Amtek NCC does make repeat cycle timers along the lines of their CKK series which can be found here. They have draw backs in their ranging however as to what you want.

Given a commercial choice I would likely lean towards a Macromatic TD8 Series type timer. This can be configured for a repeat cycle On / Off operation with the sort of timing you seem to be looking for.

Moving along to building or rolling your own can get sort of complex. Not impossible and very doable but will require some complex timing and quite a bit of assembly. This includes making circuit boards. Not easy stuff for someone new to the game.

If you can share exactly what this project is about maybe we can be of more help.

Ron
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest threads

New Articles From Microcontroller Tips

Back
Top