Rules of good behaviour getting forgot in the ETO chat

[Boncuk]

Hi friends,

just to start with a minor, but important detail about "general education" which was also part of my foregoing thread.

When I left home for school my mother always "good byed" standing at the kitchen window. If there was a neighbor I forgot to salute for a good day she called me back asking me "Haven't you forgot anything?"

I knew what I had forgotten and returned back to my way greeting the neighbor friendly.

After a while I didn't need anymore reminder because that simple rule of politeness had gotten into my blood.

When ETO chat was brought up everybody was nice and polite and I enjoyed participating in the "club", mainly thought to be mentioned for small talk and problems other than electronics.

That kind of behaviour seems to diminish more and more every day.

When I logged in today I greeted three members by name, one by one after a general "Hi".

I waited for ten minutes to receive any reply - but very much to my regret - there was none.

Especially newcomers use the chat as platform for their unsolved problems.

Here is an example: I have problem - What problem? - It's secret, I can't tell u more - Pease name the problem - I can't tell problem, it's secret. Give me source and hex code quickly.

That is certainly something which belongs into the garbage can, but some try to find out how they can help.

If this goes on for a while the community of ETO will consist 24,000 expendable members.

Make your decision to keep up the good manners at ETO.

Kind regards to all

Boncuk

 

[RichTheDude]

The world seems to be becoming a colder place – or at least it is in the UK anyway. People seem more interested in listening to music or checking facebook (or whatever) on their phones than taking part in the environment around them, and I guess such behaviours are spilling elsewhere.

In regard to the “secret project brigade”, if they are really working on a secret project in industry and ask for help on chat rooms, they need the sack due to incompetence and the potential breach of an NDA and or disclosing trade secrets. I severely doubt any of them are in industry though, I think they are asking for assignment help! Asking on the public forum would potentially give their game away to their academic supervisors!

I think the internet maybe affecting some people in younger generations, (I believe there has been a paper published about this topic) in that they expect an answevr to be given to them. Pretty much any homework type problem and its solutions can be found via Google. I am just old enough to have gone through school where I had to solve such problems myself with books and my notes. Of course some people will always want to learn properly, alas others will not!

Also if I wanted advice from my supervisor I would give a through description of the problem, how I propose to solve the problem and a diagram (schematic and/or block diagram). A simple diagram would make helping people so much easier.

 

[3v0]

I must admit that chat is not as friendly as it used to be. The problem is that trying to enforce friendliness is, like enforcing morals, impossible.

Members have two powerful tools they can use when in the chat lobby.

The first is IGNORE. You will find this option under each name in the "Online Users" panel.

The other is the tabs (thank you EM). You can suggest that people take a conversation to another tab, or go to another tab and invite people to join you there.



The problem of people asking for help is far more problematic. Who is to play god and draw the line between a legitimate request and one that is not. Maybe if you are the only person interested in helping someone you can move to another tab.

3v0

 

[ElectroMaster]

I feel that the people who tend to be rude are people that haven't made many posts in the forum and are in a hurry to get answers. They push for answers for a one time project and once they have them never come back. So maybe these people don't deserve to be in the chat?

What I was thinking was hiding the chat button to people with less than 10 posts. What do you think?

 

[3v0]

I expect we could go as low as 3 posts and keep 95% or better of these people out of chat. Most post once then go right to chat.

 

[DerStrom8]

I feel that the people who tend to be rude are people that haven't made many posts in the forum and are in a hurry to get answers. They push for answers for a one time project and once they have them never come back. So maybe these people don't deserve to be in the chat?

What I was thinking was hiding the chat button to people with less than 10 posts. What do you think?

I think that's a great idea, EM. It sure would save a lot of hassle.


Thank you, Hans, for starting this thread. I've noticed the same thing happening lately. Have manners completely been forgotten?

I hope I was not one of the members who did not reply. Sometimes I log in and almost immediately forget that I did

 

[ElectroMaster]

I have now set it so the chat button only shows once you have 3 or more posts. Thank you all for your suggestions and feedback.

Regards,
EM

 

[ericgibbs]

hi EM,
Personally I think Chat runs perfectly well as it is, its just a few members who see themselves as self appointed Moderators and want to impose their version of the Forum Rules against members who do not fit into their personal criteria.

If a chatter is being 'rude', how do you define rude. ?
If someone doesn't wish to say "Hello" when coming onto Chat, I do not see that as a problem.

Some of our chat regulars see themselves as belonging to an elite group and any wannabe who asks a simple question gets told he should study and learn the subject, which is total nonsense.

If a wannabe just wants to flash an LED using a 555 or a PIC he should be either helped or redirected to start a Thread on the Forums, not be preached at about his laziness or be disrespected.

The existing Moderators already do apply the Forum Rules to anyone on Chat who breaks those rules.

Eric

 

[ElectroMaster]

No matter what type of member that signs up to ETO, I feel that they should always experience the forums first and then if they want to stick around the chat is an excellent tool which is a more personal experience and where you can become true friends with one another. As well as that its also a great platform to teach.

If a chatter is being 'rude', how do you define rude. ? If someone doesn't wish to say "Hello" when coming onto Chat, I do not see that as a problem.

Anyone can write a complaint to me or any other moderator about another members' behaviour while in chat.. We will then look up the chat logs and discuss it within the private moderators forum as a group. If we feel it is serious we will take appropriate action. This helps mitigate from a single point of view and helps to keep things objective.

I also agree that nobody should stress themselves about not being responded to when saying hello. There can be many reasons why someone doesn't respond and it shouldn't be taken personally.

If a wannabe just wants to flash an LED using a 555 or a PIC he should be either helped or redirected to start a Thread on the Forums, not be preached at about his laziness or be disrespected.

Agreed, senior members or members that have been around for some time should set the example of how to treat others and should always respect fellow members, even if they are flying by with one question!

 

[MrAl]

Hello,

Yes judging a person's intent is one of the hardest things to do in this world, especially when the information on hand to judge with is so limited. You really have to know someone very well before you can judge them, and even then it's still somewhat of a guess. It takes a lot of time and experience.

Some will abuse, some wont. Some might not abuse at first, then abuse later. Some might abuse at first, then come to an understanding and stop that behavior.

 

[RichTheDude]

Apologies for my old man styled rant, it is not aimed at anyone in particular (and does not apply to all students) and is an observation of which myself and others have witnessed primarily outside of ETO.

I have never told anyone to study on the chat, nor have I ever said to a person I thought they were being lazy. If I do not feel competent enough to help and no one else chips in I suggest they search/ask in the forums.

 

[DerStrom8]

Apologies for my old man styled rant, it is not aimed at anyone in particular (and does not apply to all students) and is an observation of which myself and others have witnessed primarily outside of ETO.

I have never told anyone to study on the chat, nor have I ever said to a person I thought they were being lazy. If I do not feel competent enough to help and no one else chips in I suggest they search/ask in the forums.

Same here. I can't say that I've ever seen anyone tell a newbie to study on the chat and refuse to help them. The closest I've seen is when a member comes in saying he has an exam in two hours, and he asks people to teach him the equivalent of an entire class. Some members (Including myself, I admit) have asked them "Didn't your teacher show you how to do that", or ask them "Why didn't you start studying earlier?", but the members still help in what ways they can. Obviously it wouldn't be possible to teach them the entire class, but they still do their best to help them.

I really enjoy getting newbies on the forum, and in the chat. The only thing that really bugs me are the newbies that jump into chat and demand answers immediately without expecting to do some work to get them. Personally, I do not just give people answers. I prefer to teach them how to get them by themselves, so that they can do it again in the future. The phrase I use to describe my opinion of teaching here is, "Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day. Teach him to fish, and he'll eat for a lifetime."

 

[Boncuk]

hi EM,
Personally I think Chat runs perfectly well as it is, its just a few members who see themselves as self appointed Moderators and want to impose their version of the Forum Rules against members who do not fit into their personal criteria.

Eric

Sounds OK with me. You just forgot to mention the addressee(s).

 

[DerStrom8]

hi EM,
Personally I think Chat runs perfectly well as it is, its just a few members who see themselves as self appointed Moderators and want to impose their version of the Forum Rules against members who do not fit into their personal criteria.

Eric, I think the main problem is that there aren't always moderators on the chat. If there were, I don't think you'd see as much of these so-called "self-appointed moderators" trying to keep the chat clean. I agree--that's what the moderators are for, but if there are none there, then the responsibility is left to what members are present.

 

[ericgibbs]

Eric, I think the main problem is that there aren't always moderators on the chat. If there were, I don't think you'd see as much of these so-called "self-appointed moderators" trying to keep the chat clean. I agree--that's what the moderators are for, but if there are none there, then the responsibility is left to what members are present.

I would ask what do you define as 'clean'.??? and what action do you take when you consider a member is not clean.???

Has anyone formally asked you too take on this 'responsibility' as you call it.??

This is what I meant by self appointed Moderators.

 

[DerStrom8]

I would ask what do you define as 'clean'.??? and what action do you take when you consider a member is not clean.???

Well, for starters, language. If a user starts using harsh language, they should be spoken to. Generally that should be done by a moderator, but if there aren't any there, I still don't want to see all that language. So I, for example, would ask "Please watch your language". Nothing too extreme.

Has anyone formally asked you too take on this 'responsibility' as you call it.??

No, but I sure don't want to see things get out of hand. I don't want to see nasty language plastered all over my chat window. For that reason, I feel it is the members' responsibility to ask the poster to be more considerate of others.

 

[ericgibbs]

Electromaster has already told you what action to take:

Extract from his earlier post.

Anyone can write a complaint to me or any other moderator about another members' behaviour while in chat.. We will then look up the chat logs and discuss it within the private moderators forum as a group. If we feel it is serious we will take appropriate action. This helps mitigate from a single point of view and helps to keep things objective.

 

[RichTheDude]

I have yet to witness anything bad, but if such a thing did happen I would rather have some of the more known chat participants attempting to calm things down whilst waiting for the admins to come and do their duty. Then again I am not an admin here, and I have no inclination of wanting to be one.

 

[DerStrom8]

Electromaster has already told you what action to take:

Extract from his earlier post.

Anyone can write a complaint to me or any other moderator about another members' behaviour while in chat.. We will then look up the chat logs and discuss it within the private moderators forum as a group. If we feel it is serious we will take appropriate action. This helps mitigate from a single point of view and helps to keep things objective.

Yes Eric, I agree with that, but that does not help in the short term. Language is the main one for me, as I don't feel it's appropriate to have harsh language all over the chat window. Sending a PM to EM may help stop it in the future, but in the short term, it's still all there, in the chat. Do you see what I mean? I'm not trying to take control of anything. I simply want the atmosphere to remain friendly and free of inappropriate content.

 

[ericgibbs]

If you agree with ElectroMaster's directive, please follow it.

By harsh language, do you mean obscene/bad language, if so, have you made any formal complaint by PM to Admin or a Moderator in the past few days.???