Phase degrees in series with a Time based delay

[walters]

A BBD chip doesn't do a time delay produces different phase shfts at different frequencies

A phase shift network does that not a BBD time delay chip

 

[audioguru]

A BBD chip doesn't do a time delay produces different phase shfts at different frequencies

A phase shift network does that not a BBD time delay chip

Of course a bucket brigade chip produces a time delay. That's how they work! When its delayed output or more than one output is added to the input in a mixer, notches and phase shifts at different frequencies occur. .
A phase-shift circuit also produces notches and phase shfts but at different frequencies than a time delay circuit.

 

[walters]

A phase-shift circuit also produces notches and phase shfts but at different frequencies than a time delay circuit

How does a phase shift produes notches and phase shifts Different than a BBD does?

 

[audioguru]

Articles on the web explain comb filters and show differences between time-delay and phase-shift comb filters. You can hear the difference in sound samples that are played.

I'm not interested in how there are differences, I'm interested in the electronic circuits that make them.

 

[evandude]

Does a BBD chip create degrees or phase angles?

because 40us=360 degrees
so if the BBD time period delay it 40us would that be 360 degrees?

Sounds like you're confused, first off, "degrees or phase angles" refer to the same thing, degrees is just a measure of phase angle.

Since you don't give much context, I feel I need to make sure you realize that 40us = 360 degrees ONLY for a signal of 25KHz, since 40us is the period of a 25KHz signal. In the case that you were dealing with a 25KHz signal, yes, a time period delay of 40us would be a 360 degree phase shift... if you fed any other signal frequency into it, the phase shift would be different.

if the difference between a phase shift and a time delay isn't intuitive, perhaps you should play around with some graphing software, and graph some sine waves of varying frequencies with different phase shifts and/or time delays. without an intuitive grasp on that, I think it will be hard to really understand how this system idea of yours will actually be working.

I can't speak with any real experience on the kinds of guitar effects systems it seems are the subject here. so I will provide my view from the standpoint of my knowledge of the theoretical/math side of it, which is about all they give you in college :lol:

for instance, do you understand why the time delay system will produce notches? it is because for certain frequencies, the particular time delay in use corresponds to a 180 degree phase shift. in a feedback system, if you feed back a 180 degree phase-shifted version of the input, the two signals cancel each other out, it's destructive interference.

 

[walters]

Mixing phase shift network and Time delay= ? what would it be

What kind of math does phaser shifter use?

What kind of math does Time delays use? or BBD delay chips?

What kind of calculus functions or formulas are used for time delays and phasers please?

Sine,cosine, triangles? Vectors?

 

[mstechca]

Mixing phase shift network and Time delay= ? what would it be

To me, pure nonsense, and impractical. I can't see time and phases mixing with each other. The above posters told you how to do conversions.

What kind of math does Time delays use?

If you make a circuit using a 555 timer, the simplest way to determine the time delay (if a short is connected between pins 6 and 7) would be about (2 * pi * capacitor value in farads * resistor value in ohms). Your answer will be in seconds. pi would equal whatever pie is. something like 3.141592

BBD delay chips?

I never used them so I can't help.

What kind of calculus functions or formulas are used for time delays and phasers please?

Do you have to ask the same question twice in the same post?

Sine,cosine, triangles? Vectors?

You don't even need to know calculus to determine a simple time delay.

 

[walters]

But What kind of math is used for phaser shifters and time delays?

Lead and Lag formulas?

 

[walters]

I know techs use geometry,trig, calculus to do phase shift and time delay formulas and functions which ones should i know or do ?

 

[walters]

This is a good phaser shift time delay site
i like this alot

http://www.analyzemath.com/trigonometry/sine.htm

here is some others
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If i have a phase shift circuit what math can i use ?

 

[audioguru]

If i have a phase shift circuit what math can i use ?

Just build the circuit from a Guitar Effects Projects Site using trimpots to adjust the amount of shift and its frequencies. I thought you want to hear if a variable phase shift makes any difference to the sound, not just sit there and number-crunch.

 

[walters]

i Want to know the math formulas and functions so i can be a designer
which math do i use please?

 

[walters]

How do i have a trim pot changing the Shift? without changing the frequency?

 

[audioguru]

In a phase shift circuit, each frequency has a different phase shift.

 

[walters]

Yes so u can't have a seperate trim for the shift? and the frequency?
or can u and how can u seperate the shift from the frequency trims?

 

[audioguru]

Yes so u can't have a seperate trim for the shift? and the frequency?
or can u and how can u seperate the shift from the frequency trims?

Look-up Flanger in Google.

 

[walters]

i have

so u can't have a seperate trim for the shift? and the frequency?
or can u and how can u seperate the shift from the frequency trims?

How can i have a seperate trim for the Shift and frequency?

They seem like the shift and frequency are "tied" or ganged together

The LFO shifts the phase shift degree and frequency at the same time its ganged or tied together so how can i seperate the shift and frequency trims?

 

[audioguru]

I looked at Guitar Phase-Shifters in Google.
Some of the links had effects units for sale with excellent sound examples.
Maybe you want the type of sound they create, a few sounded like a time-delay flanger and like a Leslie speaker spinning slowly.

 

[walters]

i have alot of guitar pedals and DSP processors

 

[audioguru]

i have alot of guitar pedals and DSP processors

Then use them.
I have a lot of opamps, Cmos ICs, low dropout regulators and LEDs and I use them in new circuits frequently.