Firearms Countermeasures

[Val Gretchev]

Who said engineers didn't know how to have fun?

 

[jpanhalt]

As for your basic premise of adding energy and strengthening the molecular bonds in explosives so they can't explode, as has been pointed out, it is contrary to known physics. To be more specific, with any compound at normal temperatures, almost all of the molecules are at ground state. If you add energy, a small proportion can be excited. Those excited states are more reactive. In the case of many molecules, decomposition is favored.

The energy in gun powder comes from a recombination of the molecules to give new ground states in which the energies are lower. And of course, a lot of energy is released in the process. That recombination only occurs after some change in the system, e.g., a spark, initiates it. The same thing happens when gasoline burns in an engine.

For your concept to work, you would have to remove energy from stable molecular bonds. That is, go to a molecular state below ground state, i.e., a molecular orbital quantum number <0. I don't believe any such states have been observed. If you could do that, you could extract energy from any source, even water. Now, that would be something. But, ask yourself what would the product of water minus energy be?

In the alternative, maybe you are talking about producing a type of endothermic nuclear fusion. That is not prohibited by current physics, but would require a lot of energy. Thus, in a very over simplified view, you could fuse the sulfur oxidant (atomic number 16) to give an isotope of germanium (atomic number 32), which would result in a gun powder that would not explode. (Note: That is just for illustration. I don't know what happens if you fuse two sulfur atoms.)

John

Edit: BTW, this atom crusher would have to be very targeted, so you didn't in the process of inactivating the gun powder kill both the shooter and his target.

 

[Val Gretchev]

Thank you for your candid and excellent explanation of the workings of atoms in a compond. You must be either a Physicist or a Chemist. I was hoping that someone like you would join the fray with his opinion.

You have pointed out an alternative that I had not considered, i.e. – transmutation of the elements in a gunpowder mixture. Yes, indeed, that would take an awful lot of energy but is something that could be considered.

In order to make progress on an invention such as this would require many disciplines in a think-tank environment and also a lot of money. Perhaps they would eventually conclude that it is not feasible. I will consider this thread a success if I was able to get a few people just thinking about it.

 

[jpanhalt]

If that subject interests you, read more about cold fusion here: https://www.google.com/webhp#hl=en&...pw.r_qf.&fp=5936a6d8fe4522bb&biw=1024&bih=675

Fleischmann and Pons at the University of Utah became the face of cold fusion in the United States. They had just enough evidence, theory, and scientific credibility to make a lot of people believe in it and to get substantial funding.

John

 

[tvtech]

It seems I got promoted. Does it mean anything that they are red?

You need a little bit of Green. Red is bad. Green is good. Here is a little bit of Green for you. Please stay sane and all

And enjoy your retirement. Don't work too hard.

Regards,
tvtech

Edit: I never realized that I could take a Member from one Green bar to ten Green bars with one Rep...
I planned on only one extra bar....

I don't understand

Stuff to think about.

 

[Val Gretchev]

I feel like a 5 star general already! How did you do that???

 

[tvtech]

I feel like a 5 star general already! How did you do that???

By giving a little Rep.

Now I am serious about things....no fun and games anymore....My future is at risk. South Africa's youngsters are growing up to be clueless idiots due to the uselessness of the ANC. A whole Generation of uneducated people/kids/beings that break everything down....instead of building anything usefull...destroy, destroy, destroy seems to be the logic here.

Over stupids. I am too old to re-invent the African wheel...the one that never turns. The one that fails EVERY SINGLE TIME the majority gets the Vote....as in the Sheeple. Everywhere in Africa.

They will stupidly vote for the very person that is promising them things they don't really know or care about...

...Like a Toilet
...or fresh running water

They do not know these things. They are happy with what they have always had......why change these Morons into people that can take a car and drive it on a highway and kill people???. Without a License. Naturally.

I paint a bleak picture. I am in the middle of this nonsense. No lies here.

Regards,
tvtech

 

[shortbus=]

Take heart! It's the whole world, things here in US are the same way.

 

[Val Gretchev]

A slight variation on the theme.

When I was a student at the University of Toronto 50 years ago studying electrical engineering, I observed a demonstration where liquid Oxygen was poured onto the poles of a very strong magnet. The liquid Oxygen formed a bridge from one pole to the other and was suspended in the air proving that it could be attracted magnetically.

If this was possible to do with Oxygen in air at normal temperature and pressures, i.e. – make Oxygen slightly more attractive that Nitrogen, then you would have the makings of a weapon of mass destruction.

One can imagine a cone of electro-magnetic energy beamed from an aircraft towards the ground. A slight tug on the Oxygen molecules in air would tend to separate and lift the Oxygen above ground while leaving the Nitrogen behind with bad results for anyone caught in its path.

 

[jpanhalt]

The ground state of oxygen is triplet, i.e., it has unpaired electrons. It is paramagnetic and attracted to magnets. That is most pronounced in the liquid phase for the obvious reasons that you can see it, and it is more dense..

Here are some references that may be of interest:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_oxygen
https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=61808

Now, for your weapon of mass destruction, it seems you want an immense magnet, something like a neutron star, that will suck the oxygen right out of the enemy ....

Magnetic monopoles don't exist. At least they have never been demonstrated. Thus, while your magnet is sucking the oxygen from the enemy, what is the other pole doing to you?

I'd take a small, tactical nuke any day.

John

 

[tvtech]

Hey Val..

You were Repped by default...

That initially got you the little green bar. After being red. Never mind...Less repping for me. Have to be cautious here with stuff.

Only people that I am sure are good to go..

Regards,
tvtech

 

[3v0]

Sorry about getting serious here.

If people are out to kill each other they will get the job done with bullets, cross bows, knives or rocks. Lets start by regulating the rocks. It is not about what people have at hand to harm each other. It is more about their intent to do so.

I live in a country with at least as money guns as people. You can walk the streets at 2AM without fear. Gun control will never achieve that.

 

[jpanhalt]

3v0,

I couldn't agree with you more. Like Archie Bunker said in an earlier time, just give everyone who gets on an airplane a loaded gun. Hijacker problem solved. He might say today, the only body search that needs to be made is to be sure you are pack'n.

John

 

[dougy83]

Hey Val..
You were Repped by default...
That initially got you the little green bar. After being red. Never mind...Less repping for me. Have to be cautious here with stuff.
Only people that I am sure are good to go..

I'm pretty sure most people realise how meaningless the whole rep system is. Kiss one person's butt and you get excellent rep, annoy a single person and you're in the red.

 

[3v0]

I would like to see a separate rep system for technical and non technical forums. I think it would be more meaningful.

 

[dougy83]

Take heart! It's the whole world, things here in US are the same way.

The US is not the whole world. The situation in my country is certainly not in any way similar to South Africa's. While the competence of the parties here may be questionable, they are certainly not malevolent or power hungry; people aren't threatened to vote either way (just lied to and persuaded).

I live in a country with at least as money guns as people. You can walk the streets at 2AM without fear. Gun control will never achieve that.

I live in a country in which guns are controlled and rare (except for in gun clubs, on police officers or money transport security staff). I too can walk around the streets, the bush tracks, etc. at any time of night without fear. I would much rather be held up by someone with a knife (or a rock as you mentioned ) than ~ with a gun.

I would like to see a separate rep system for technical and non technical forums. I think it would be more meaningful.

Like a social rep. vs. tech. rep... It certainly would add meaning to the rep. mark.

 

[Val Gretchev]

tvtech:
Have you considered immigrating to Canada? A lot of your countrymen have done so already. I’ll bet there is a big support group here that can help you. The only thing that can be an impediment is age and health.
Val

 

[jpanhalt]

Maybe there should be a separate thread on the rep system, if we are allowed to discuss such things?

I would like that thread to begin with a knowledgeable person describing the current system and the rationale for the relationship of the points awarded to an individual to the points the awarder has.

John

 

[3v0]

The problem with people discussing moderation is that they seldom know what mods hare already done to solve the problem. It is much easier for everyone if moderation is left to moderators under the scrutiny of EM.

I do not see where there is any problem suggesting a change to the rep system but it really belongs in the feedback forum.

 

[jpanhalt]

I wasn't suggesting discussion of moderation. Frankly, I agree that should be off limits in the open forum. If there is any moderation of the rep system it is invisible to us foot soldiers.

What I suggested was: 1) A thread devoted to the issue, if warranted -- rather than take this threat further OT; and 2) That someone (presumably EM) set the stage with an accurate description of our current system. If such description exists, it is certainly hard to find in the expected places, such as Community Rules.

John