Bridged pads on mainboard

[xboxhaxorz]

I accidentally did this while removing the solder. I believe i caused the solder to stick to the copper which i caused to appear by rushing through the solder removal process.

I have tried some braid which does not help. I assume i need to scrape away the solder gently. But i was hoping for tips on how to do this?

**broken link removed**

 

[picbits]

Solder sucker would be good for that - just heat the solder, press the button on the sucker and everything near its tip suddenly vanishes

 

[blueroomelectronics]

Why did you desolder the CPU?

 

[xboxhaxorz]

Solder sucker would be good for that - just heat the solder, press the button on the sucker and everything near its tip suddenly vanishes

Really, i thought you couldnt suck solder from copper and if thats untrue is there a sucker you recommend or is this fine Amazon.com: Solder Sucker: Home Improvement?

Why did you desolder the CPU?

Its actually the GPU and its because the lack of cooling caused it to overheat and the solder to crack. So i am replacing the solder with high quality solder and reinstalling the chip.

 

[picbits]

Thats the solder sucker I've got.

You'll never get all the solder off the copper - once you've "tinned" it, its on there to stay. The best you can do is to get as much off as possible.

The solder sucker will help get rid of the solder bridges.

If you use desolder braid, you need a fairly hefty (>50 watt) soldering iron otherwise it just drains the heat from the braid and the braid sticks to the board.

I normall suck up big blobs of solder and use the braid for cleaning up afterwards.

 

[xboxhaxorz]

My iron is temp controlled set to 350c. When i did the cleaning of the solder i think i had too high at 450c so now its set at 350c. I tried the braid several times with and without flux. Guess ill order the sucker and give it a shot, the worst that could happen is i have a new tool for my repairs.

 

[Mickster]

Looks like you're starting out re-balling 360 GPU's....

This link (using the proper equipment) may help:
YouTube - Reballing x box 360
2:45 shows the start of the cleanup process of the lead free solder.

Use plenty of flux and keep the iron/desolder braid moving. Those tiny pads are easy to lift if you stay over one spot too long. Don't ask how I know ;-)

These links may also help:
**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**
Forums.Xbox-experts.com - View topic - OFFICIAL REBALLING THREAD XBOX-EXPERTS......

HTH.

EDIT.
Just looked at your image again...
Looks like you have a couple of broken traces near to the top right, along with lifted traces about halfway down the right hand side.

 

[cowana]

With that amount of burning and de-lamination of the PCB, I'd be extreamly surprised if that board ever works again, even with a new GPU. I think you've done more damage than you think.

My advice would to buy a complete new PCB, complete with components.

 

[xboxhaxorz]

Thanks for the links, i have moved on from reflowing to reballing. Have a brand new machine and am getting used to it, i do have some scratched traces but looking carefully with a magnifier i do not find any to be lifted or broken the picture is probably not clear but thanks for pointing them out.

When you say burning or delamination i do not quite understand how you mean? I find no burns could you point them out for me?

Thanks all

 

[cowana]

Maybe it is just a bad photo - is the PCB not all blackened and bubbling around the area of the pads? (Especially to the left and at the top).

 

[blueroomelectronics]

How do you know the condition of the plated through holes or the traces sandwiched between PCB layers.

How much are video cards anyway?

 

[Mickster]

I'd be concerned about the areas ringed in red in the attached pic, which look to have been damaged when removing the epoxy (or whatever it is) which holds down the GPU.



I'd also guess that, apart from the colour of the flux, the top left charred area is also the epoxy.

@Bill:
It's not a video card, it's an Xbox 360 mainboard after the GPU has been removed for re-balling.

 

[Mickster]

When you say burning or delamination i do not quite understand how you mean? I find no burns could you point them out for me?

Thanks all

Delamination can occur due to a number of reasons, although the photo doesn't appear to show any obvious delamination.
It can happen due to a number of situations including poor PCB construction, excessive heat, too fast ramping of heat, or excessive moisture contained in the PCB when heat is applied.
A proper reflow profile for lead-free solder should be followed prior to lifting the GPU. The Manncorp profile Xbox 360 Repair Solution by Manncorp seems to be the one which most people base their own profile from and make adjustments to, in order to suit their own equipment. However, this assumes a PCB with minimal moisture content, which is the reason why the PCB may (should) require a low temp bake for a number of hours, to drive out any moisture.

P.S. You may also see delamination referred to as 'Pop-corning' within the reflowing/reballing community.

 

[blueroomelectronics]

Bet it's time for a new XBox. Are the new ones less prone to the RROD than the old ones?

 

[Mickster]

According to Microsoft, the new Xbox 360 cannot develop the RROD.....probably because they have done away with that method of error reporting..

But it does appear to be of a more thought out design, since the fan is mounted directly to the heatsink and exhausts straight out of the case, via vents in the top cover (assuming it is laid flat).

Time will tell I guess.....

 

[blueroomelectronics]

According to Microsoft, the new Xbox 360 cannot develop the RROD.....probably because they have done away with that method of error reporting..

LOL awesome, now that's how you fix a problem I guess that's what you get from a software company.

 

[xboxhaxorz]

Maybe it is just a bad photo - is the PCB not all blackened and bubbling around the area of the pads? (Especially to the left and at the top).

Actually thats some amtech flux which is apparently bad, the new flux i used dont look that way

 

[xboxhaxorz]

I'd be concerned about the areas ringed in red in the attached pic, which look to have been damaged when removing the epoxy (or whatever it is) which holds down the GPU.

View attachment 48606

I'd also guess that, apart from the colour of the flux, the top left charred area is also the epoxy.

@Bill:
It's not a video card, it's an Xbox 360 mainboard after the GPU has been removed for re-balling.

Thanks for taking the time, i scratched the board with a fiberglass pen and found all the traces to be fine except for the bottom right below the gpu area but appears to be a simple trace repair. However the bridged joints did not get fixed with the solder sucker i even put more leaded solder on it but it just sucked the fresh solder off.

 

[xboxhaxorz]

According to Microsoft, the new Xbox 360 cannot develop the RROD.....probably because they have done away with that method of error reporting..

But it does appear to be of a more thought out design, since the fan is mounted directly to the heatsink and exhausts straight out of the case, via vents in the top cover (assuming it is laid flat).

Time will tell I guess.....

It is improved yes, but there have already been several reports of failures. Its mostly because the use of the lead free flux which causes the failures.
Dont you wonder why your NES or SEGA still works lol, because of leaded flux plus the fact that things were built better back then and not rushed