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Thugs scared off by pocket knife

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How can a gun be used to defend yourself when your attacker is also armed?

The whole idea of allowing people to be armed in order to defend themselves is total rubbish.

A gun is totally useless against another person also carrying a gun, it simply becomes Russian roulette.

What decides who wins a gun battle?

The person who draws first.

If someone is using a gun to threaten you, they've already drawn first and won before you even get the chance to reach for your weapon.

If someone really wants to rob you, they'll shoot you in the back, before you even get the chance to react.

If someone wants to burgle your house, they'll make sure they're armed, wearing a bulletproof vest and will be prepared to shoot you before you get there first. They'll also probably be used to the idea of shooting someone and be a better shot than an innocent person.

As far as the idea that allowing citizens to bear arms will prevent a totalitarian regime from gaining power; that's nonsense too. The army will always have more powerful weapons than average civilians; what use is an ordinary rifle against an army equipped with tanks, grenades and automatic weapons?

The only argument I can see for allowing people to carry weapons is a pure libertarian one; the idea that people should be free to carry a gun to use as they see fit, as long as it doesn't break the law.

I think that some gun control is a good idea, simple because guns a dangerous and the authorities should control anything that's highly dangerous. Cars are dangerous so the government licences them and restricts their use to only those who have passed a test, indicating they're competent to drive them and I don't see why it shouldn't be any different with guns.

I think that limiting the supply of arms is a good idea because it does make it harder for criminals to get hold of them, even though there's no way of stopping it.
 
Hero, my country was born, just from the simple fact that the citizens did have guns (and the main government was many months away, across the ocean...). For home protection, a shotgun is best, since you don't have to be very precise in aiming it. Carrying a gun, at least gives someone a chance to defend themselves. Bullets are kind of small, and doubt most thugs are well trained either. It's not just your personal protection, but for people around you as well. A gun usually wins, if confronted with a thug armed with a knife or club. A gun doesn't guarantee safety, but it's better than nothing at all for some people.

Over in England, you don't own guns, but don't people still get robbed and murdered (with guns)?
 
I see a CanWorms.jpg.

I'll be back later with my popcorn and beer.:D

Mike.
 
Over in England, you don't own guns, but don't people still get robbed and murdered (with guns)?

It's really very rare - gun controls have always been VERY strict over here, but shotguns (and licences) are relatively easy to get hold off. Rifles and licences are MUCH more difficult, and handguns impossible (even for the Olympic pistol shotting team).

The only handguns you can have are antique types, muzzle loaders, or ball and power. I've shot a 'Dirty Harry' type revolver, but loading it was a 15-20 minutes job, with each cylinder been individually loaded with ball, powder, wadding, percussion cap.

Crooks do sometimes have illegal guns though, and the Police often do as well.
 
You don't stand a chance from a surprise attack no matter what weapon you have!

A gun usually wins, if confronted with a thug armed with a knife or club. A gun doesn't guarantee safety, but it's better than nothing at all for some people.
I doubt it.

I want to mug you, I creep up on up behind your back and whack you round the back of the head (near the brain stem), so hard it either kills you or incapacitates you for long enough for me to rob you, take your gun and shoot you, before you have chance to react.

A large knife can also be used to stab you in the back, piercing your ribcage, puncturing a lung and possibly your heart, before you even get chance to defend yourself. It's also possible to grab you from behind and slit your throat, before you have chance to react.

Even if I confront you face on with a knife, I could probably stab you before you have time to draw your weapon.

I don't even have to be determined to kill you, I could use pepper spray, a taser etc. to incapacitate you before you have time to reach for your weapon.

A gun is only any good when you're prepared for the attack. The bottom line is, you stand virtually no chance against a surprise attack, whatever weapon you're carrying.
 
I doubt it.
The bottom line is, you stand virtually no chance against a surprise attack, whatever weapon you're carrying.

The best defence is as Frosty did, assess the environment you are in and assess any potential threats in order to avoid surprises.:eek:

.
 
Hero,

We both speak English but our laws, privelidges, and guaranteed rights are different. There are two very different sides to this coin. Your country chose its own path regarding arming of citizens as did we; leave it at that. Your reasonings sound plausible yet contradictory in other ways.
 
Might just be me, but I feel crowded and uneasy when a stranger comes with in 6 feet of me, when he doesn't have to be so close. Most people don't move softly enough to avoid drawing my attention. But I don't own a cellphone or Ipod either... Street robberies are kind of rare in small towns anyway...
 
My take:

The only weapon I usually carry with me is a pocket-knife. I never carry anything of value, and am always aware of my surroundings. I would only ever use it if I truly thought I was in danger.

Now at home, I have a (large) variety of guns, from hunting rifles, to muskets, shotguns, and handguns. I regularly shoot on my own land, and hunt with them. Again, the only time I would use them is if I felt me or my family was in danger.

After the robbery at my house I have installed an advance alarm system, and an extensive CCTV system.

I have a question for those of you who know the law better:
Around my property, (~6 acres of woods), I have no-trespassing signs all around.
Does this mean that I can legally shoot anyone who walks on? Do I have to warn them first?
Obviously, I would never just do that, but I have been wondering about this for a while.
 
I doubt that any state will allow you to shoot someone for just trespassing.
 
Hey! I thought up another situation I have been pondering about:

Say I'm in my house, watching TV. Suddenly some guy kicks in a window in another room (to steal stuff). What are my abilities in this situation.
I would assume I can't do anything unless it would fall under self-defense?
 
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Hey! I thought up another situation I have been pondering about:

Say I'm in my house, watching TV. Suddenly some guy kicks in a window in another room (to steal stuff). What are my abilities in this situation.
I would assume I can't do anything unless it would fall under self-defense?

At the moment someone kicks in your window to make entry, there is reasonable cause for you to perceive possible harm to yourself and as such your are justified in protecting yourself. Now if the perpetrator see's your gun and begins to run away and you shoot him as he flees, then you would be in the wrong.
 
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Hey! I thought up another situation I have been pondering about:

Say I'm in my house, watching TV. Suddenly some guy kicks in a window in another room (to steal stuff). What are my abilities in this situation.
I would assume I can't do anything unless it would fall under self-defense?

Here's some food for thought: (please do not interpret the following as being lectured to)

Regarding both of your questions remember this very important fact: ignorance of the law is no excuse
You will see that written into many Federal, State, and local municipality lawbooks. Basically, it places the responsibility of knowing the legal limits or how to respond (legally) when confronted in a situation. I understand that us common folks can't properly interpret the legal jargon in the lawbooks but that's the way American society has set it up. Heck, even trying to look up such laws can be a challenge. I've even asked law enforcement officials for answers that they themselves seemed ambiguous about it! In a court of law you can't save yourself when standing before the judge and jury by saying that the sheriff or some cop told you that you could shoot a robber for stealing your DVD player and trashing your home. You'll be in a much better situation when investigators learn that you were backed into a room with an attacker threatening your life or safety. Besides, think about this: are you prepared to live out the remainder of your life with the nagging and gloomy thought that you (potentially) killed a thug in your home because he decided to break a window, steal a laptop, some jewelry, and maybe a wallet/purse? To me that's some heavy guilt baggage to carry around. When you kill a person you erase all they ever were and all that they could become, not to mention how it affects their circle of family and friends (despite how dastardly and ruthless this person may be).


I choose to interpret the above phrase like this: it's better to err on the side of restraint and caution.

I would suggest that you inquire into your state and local ordinances on tresspassing issues and what ever other scenarios you feel might justify using deadly force. Also remember that simply drawing and aiming a firearm at someone (not discharging it) can bring about serious felony charges if you are found to be in the wrong, despite how you interpreted the situation at the time. Owning and using firearms brings on GREAT RESPONSIBILITY.

 
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When you kill a person you erase all they ever were and all that they could become, not to mention how it affects their circle of family and friends (despite how dastardly and ruthless this person may be).

Except we're not talking about 'persons' we're talking about 'scumbags', who are probably better off removed from the gene pool.

At one time an Englishman's home was his castle - unfortunately this is no longer true.

Again, from a martial arts point of view, we teach put them down, and put them down HARD - it's far easier arguing in court afterwards than from a slab in the morgue.
 
Don't you teach reasonable force?

I think you should, it's fair enough putting them down hard, but continuing to beat someone once they're on the floor is not reasonable force so you deserve to get done for murder, if they die or GBH if they're severely injured.
 
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