I need help in building a popcorn popper from hairdryer parts

[jpoopdog]

hello,

I just recently used a popcorn machine, and after a closer inspection, i found out it uses pretty much the same hardware as a hair dryer.


So i now want to try and build a popcorn popper from the parts of a hardryer, so i can also own a popcorn popper, but also write a tutorial on how to make one, since i cant find any tutorial, and i think others would find it very useful.

Heres what i have

2x 3.3M lengths of 20ohm/M nichrome wire, of 0.7mm width
1x AC motor with fan


Now, the problem i have is, i dont know how hot the nichrome is allowed to go to before it melts or burns, i dont know if it needs to be regulated. The other problem is that because a proper popcorn popper has its wire arranged differently, and its fan being used differently, and the whole thing being 200 watts more power intensive than a hairdryer. i havent a clue on how to adapt the parts of the hairdryer. Still, while keeping it all as basic as possible, using as few electrican components as possible that cant be found in a hairdryer.





anyone with any ideas, sketches on ways to arrange the two parralell heating wire lengths , and so on, please show me, thanks. I preffer not to do trial and error with 240v, at the risk of potentially damaging my parts, as well as maybe injuring myself, though i know how to safely handle electricity, so im mostly afraid of shorting out the power in my house or blowing up my wire, since i cant really get any hair dryers for free.

Any help is greatly appreciated! thanks!

 

[Pommie]

Just buy a popcorn machine. Playing around with 240V when you are asking such basic questions is not advised.

BTW, what's wrong with a pan on a stove?

Mike.

 

[cowboybob]

Leave the hair dryer as it is.

Get a medium sized copper bowl with a lid.

Mount the hair dryer under it such that the blower end is aimed at the bottom of the bowl, leaving an adequate gap between the two so the hot air can continue to flow (1/2"?). Hot air pop corn poppers work pretty well

Palm oil and popcorn. Salt to taste.

Not only will it pop corn but also stand as an example of your recycling prowess.

 

[duffy]

You want to write a tutorial on how to make popcorn poppers out of a hairdryers... but you can't get hair dryers for free... and you don't want to do "trial and error"... and you want someone else to tell you what the design should be, using hairdryer parts. Am I reading this correctly?

I think maybe you should take Mike or Bob's advice.

 

[Mr RB]

I'd like to add that popcorn requires a real high temperature, which itself is not safe as it will melt most plastics that might be in contact with anything you build, causing things to move or short out.

High temperature electric cooking should be done on safe, commercially built equipment.

 

[jpoopdog]

You want to write a tutorial on how to make popcorn poppers out of a hairdryers... but you can't get hair dryers for free... and you don't want to do "trial and error"... and you want someone else to tell you what the design should be, using hairdryer parts. Am I reading this correctly?

I think maybe you should take Mike or Bob's advice.

I dont want to blow up the wire and need to get a new hairdryer, theres not much info out there on how to calculate how much nichrome to use at a certain voltage and such.

Anyway, i want to build this, plain and simple, its more about the building than anything else.
I wouldnt find it as much fun to go buy a brand new one, take it apart, then rebuild it.

With most my projects i am undertaking, i always seem to overlook something technical, the purpose of my asking here was to be sure that i wasnt overlooking anything.
A popcorn popper uses give or take 10% the same nichrome length and value, and the same motor but with a smaller fan

ive seen smaller more basic poppers before, so i know for a fact i can do this, i just want some second opinions and friendly suggestions.
Not negative opinions like "oh dont bother, its too hard for you, so go and buy one instead".

 

[Reloadron]

Before you even start you need about 180 degrees C or roughly 356 degrees F with about 400 degrees F preferred. As was mentioned this is pretty hot. While I have never measured the actual outlet air temperature of any of the wife's hair driers I am not sure they reach those temperatures. Next there is more to it than just wrapping some nichrome wire around a chunk of mica or ceramic. The velocity and volume of the air traveling over the heated element (removing heat) figures into the game. So you have variables to deal with.

I would start by placing a temperature sensor like a thermocouple in front of a hair drier and getting some temperature readings. Many hand held DMMs now include a temperature reading function allowing thermocouple input. If you can get 400 degrees F maybe 6 inches from the nozzle then you have a starting point. If not, then you need to start rethinking the element design. There is going to be some trial and error with this. I won't dissuade you, rather say go ahead and go for it. I would also be remiss if I didn't tell you what you already know. Working with mains voltages always presents a shock hazzard and working with heating elements throws in a burn hazard as well.

Time for me to get going to work....

Ron

 

[jpoopdog]

well actually, the fan of the hair dryer prevents the air form getting considerably hot. for instance if you were to half the fan speed, the tempurature might go up by probably less than 50%, depending on the rate at which the resistance of the nichrome increases and dissipates heat.

 

[Reloadron]

well actually, the fan of the hair dryer prevents the air form getting considerably hot. for instance if you were to half the fan speed, the tempurature might go up by probably less than 50%, depending on the rate at which the resistance of the nichrome increases and dissipates heat.

Yeah, and this is where problems can begin. The element was originally designed for that airflow and if we begin to choke down the airflow the element does indeed get hotter. The question becomes how much airflow can be reduced before the element begins to burn up and self destruct? Using a hair drier as an example, they generally have a mesh screen at the rear where cool air enters. For reasons I will never understand people who use them insist on allowing that mesh screen to become dust laden and clog restricting airflow. A good quality hair drier has a thermal cutout switch to prevent a fire and preserve the element. Turn on the unit, it runs a few min and shuts down. Then the user wonders why it shuts off? Let it cool and the same thing happens again.

The trick is working within limits. The problem is figuring how much wire and how to coil it for the right heat.

Ron

 

[jpoopdog]

and thats what im hoping someone could help me with, or at least steer me in the right direction, a direction i may add that ends with me having built this not buy one!

 

[Reloadron]

While this sort of thing is far from my forte I may be able to help you a little. I have a bunch of heating element coiled wire. No clue where it came from but I recall seeing the stuff. When I get home from work today I'll look for it. If you are in the US I'll send it to you to mess around with. I'll tell you if you want to mess with things like this a damn near indispensable tool is what is called a Variac, and a 10 amp Variac is preferred. That lets you slowly work up a voltage to an element so you can note when it gets hot. What tools do you have? You will be wanting at least a good meter.So anyway, if I find that stuff it is yours for the asking on me including the few bucks postage. You will need to figure what to mount it too and obviously mounting heating element wire on a block of wood is not a good idea.

Ron

 

[tcmtech]

Well to start off you have to be able to build it for less than $18, http://www.google.com/products/cata...Pk7T97OKoK62gXe47H0Bg&sqi=2&ved=0CJoBEPMCMAA# , out of a machine that costs at least $22 to buy! http://www.folica.com/tools/hair-dryers/hot-tools-anti-static-ionic-travel-hair-dryer

Second you have to get it to run at the correct range of heat which is around 400 - 450 degrees F or about 2 - 3 times hotter than a common hair dryer runs at . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popcorn

Third you have to keep the air flow at the correct rate and keep the kernals and pop corn fluff from falling back down into the heater/blower system and starting on fire.

 

[jpoopdog]

i already knew those things, well not that a popcorn machine was that cheap.
also reloadron, i am in auctralia, and i already have some mica sheet, i dont need your nichrome , i already have plenty, but thanks for the offer. i will look into this thing you mentioned though.

 

[Sceadwian]

You should listen to TCMtech, you'll spend more time and money making this work than you would buying one, and all you'd learn is how to spend more money then buying the proper device in the first place =) Unless you have some serious desire to learn more power large electric powered fan heaters your effort could be better spent elsewhere.

The equations for determining how hot an element will get in free air and with forced air flow are available on the net if you look hard enough, determining if the coil will melt requires only basic thermal math. The main thing you'll find is that you don't want really thing heating elements, thick is better.

 

[jpoopdog]

understood.
However the whole point of this is to build one, sharing a tutorial is way lower priority.
Since i got the hairdryer for free....... i can asume that this popcorn popper will cost less to make than it would to buy one which costs $18 , plus a likely $25 postage world wide, $10 national.
The time and effort will make the reward that much more buttery!

 

[Sceadwian]

What do you have to work with? The only two hair dryers I've taken apart were both the same, a heating coil inline with the fan motor (which is a 12VAC motor) the 'low' setting switches a diode in to drop half the AC cycle, there's VERY little to work with unless you have other support equipment/circuits around. How specifically is your hair dryer constructed internally, knowing that is the only way to proceed. Assuming the motor is inline with the element the first thing you'll need to do is separate the two and run them from different power sources, the fan if it's AC will easily run from a 12V transformer, then that leaves the coil only working on mains, but if the motor is inline with the coil then removing the motor may remove the main current limiting element, the heating coil could very well vaporize when connected directly to mains. There are a lot of unknowns, it's not like you can just glue this together all willy nilly.

Keep in mind all the plastic guts will have to be junked the plastic hair dryers are made out of won't tolerate the temperatures used to pop corn, maybe a hot air gun but you wouldn't even have to modify that in the first place! (I have one that cost 20 bucks that will easily pop corn)

So what do you have to work with? You'll need basic fabrication skills and some way to both determine the best method to drive the heating coil you have and the parts to make a circuit that can drive it. The simplest method I can think of is using a variac to control the heating coil, but that's not something most people have laying around.

 

[jpoopdog]

actually my idea was to simply remove the heating element and motor, and scrap the rest, and go on from there.
i didnt intend to keep the hairdryer in tact.
Also if this motor is ac, it should work off the unrectified 12v from a wallwart directly onto the 12v coil, if not, ill try it on 240vac.
heres a basic sketch of what i had in mind, its a very crude sketch in paint, excuse the bad details, i dont have a mouse.
https://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/846/popcorncrudeidea.png/

The fan would not be blowing very hard, just enough to lift and spiral out any pocorn that pops.
aside from small signle vent (i might put another on the other side if it doesnt work), the main coil is completely insulated by metal, but before that, mica sheet. the popcorn holder though would be made out of aluminium to ensure it absorbas and transfered the most amount of heat, as well as not rusting like steel would.
The fan would have the very thin mini coil, so that the air being blown doesnt cool down the coil too much.
Overal this should work. from what ive seen its pretty much the same as how it works in a proper popper, but the wire in there is straight, and the fan is mounted on the bottom, with no circular air movement from the fan, but rather the shape of the vents in the popper container.

 

[Sceadwian]

If the motor is in series with the coil DO NOT RUN IT ALONE ON 240AC the motor will fry.

You have to describe how the coil/motor and whatever other electronics were in the hair dryer BEFORE proceeding otherwise you're just stabbing in the dark at something that could be dangerous. You've provided no clue as to how your specific hair dryer's electrical components are put together, if you can not provide this information there is nothing anyone can do to help you.

You also failed to answer my last post as to what other components/tools you have at your disposal for doing this modification, the motor and the coil alone won't be sufficient.

How about taking some pictures of the components that you've removed (hopefully they're still connected in their original manner) because your text posts aren't sufficiently describing what you actually have to work with.

 

[tcmtech]

Basically just because a blow dryer and popcorn maker both have a fan and a heating element does not mean they are easy to convert one into another. My tractors have engines and tires but that does not mean it easy to turn them into a car just because cars also have engines and tires.

The most practical way to do this would be to buy a hot air popcorn maker and take it part and make a comparison of what is the same and what is different between the two.

The blow dryer heating element and probably wont have any issues running at 450 F over 150 F but the rest of the parts that hold the popcorn have to be able to handle that heat and work properly which is what everyone else seems to be pointing out in one way or another.

 

[Sceadwian]

The element must still be tightly power controlled. You can't slap this together with a 300% power output increase without some additional circuitry/components and thermal engineering and make it work.