Dragonfly 16F877A PIC Tutor with LCD & 4x4 keypad. Comments?

[William At MyBlueRoom]

Here's the beta schematic for kit #2.

It's a companion PCB for the Inchworm ICD2.

It's got a 16x2 backlit LCD, 4x4 keypad, piezo speaker, IR input, POT, Switch, 4MHz & 350 Solderless Breadboard & 20pin expansion header.

It's targeted at simplicity and low cost yet useful. You should be able to build 100s of projects with it.

The 16F877A was chosen because it has the most free complier support.
4MHz was chosen as an introductory speed, nice 1us clock and is the default speed for a great deal of PIC software.

It's also somewhat small approx 4"x6" to fit into a Hammond sloped case.

 

[jduncan459]

This is an old post, I know, but the kit proposed would be great.

John

 

[William At MyBlueRoom]

Thank you, I've designed a tiny version for motor control.

 

[kjennejohn]

Try this page at EL Products:
**broken link removed** with Atom

Look for his BasicBoard. This is $119.95. Has all the following goodies-

- A free, really powerful BASIC Compiler, including servo commands
- Onboard Circuitry includes:
4 - Switches
8- LEDs
2x16 LCD
Potentiometer wired to A/D
Speaker
5 Volt regulator
In-Circuit Debugger / Programming Port
2nd UART port for internal hardware UART
Expansion ports for Servo motors, external sensors(A/D ports), Digital ports, separate servo power.
Fully Assembled

I own one and can highly recommend it for experimenting with processor controls. I have never connected a servo to it, I have no experience with servos, but it does come with servo headers and power takeoffs.

'Worth checking out!
kjennejohn

 

[William At MyBlueRoom]

Do you mean this board? It's $119, and compared to the not yet completed Dragonfly its... The problem I have with the Basic Board and the EasyPIC4 is their "debugger" is really a simulator (done on the host computer). An true ICD uses hardware internal to the PIC and will support MPLAB.

Dragonfly Basic Board EasyPIC4
ICD2 add $45CDn bootloader programmer
MPLAB ATOM Basic proprietary
$79CDn appr $119US $119US
2x16 LCD with Backlight 2x16 LCD add $15
6 LEDs 8 LEDs 35 LEDs
12 buttons 4 buttons 36 buttons
350 breadboard prewired dip switches, jumpers
2 pots 1 pot 2 pots
Case optional no case no case

etc.............................................................................

If you want a basic compiler (a good one IMHO) with a demo version use a 16F877A and PICBASIC Pro Demo (free for 31lines of code and works with MPALB) Not sure how good ATOM Basic, what other PICs does it support? Here's a comparison table
**broken link removed**
The Basic Board would be better if sold minus the ATOM compiler, It's an 16F877A with a MAX232 (rs232) 8 LEDs, 4 Pushbuttons, speaker, LM7805, jumpers and a LCD. Should sell with the display for $50 or so. There's the DHMicro board for $109US available too.

Aside from the LCD display I'd be willing to bet I could teach as much if not more on my $69US Firefly T & Inchworm combo. If you must have an LCD you could always wire up an external 3 wire LCD circuit.
http://www.myke.com/lcd.htm

IMHO PIC demo boards with serial ports and 2x16 LCD displays are very common, even the Firefly has a serial port. The Basic Board is more a tutorial system like my Firefly is. Dragonfly is a Prototyping system. I would say the DHMicro is more along the lines of what I have in mind for Dragonfly.

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[kjennejohn]

Ah, yes, but...

You're right. All of these boards have their targeted audience; their pluses and minuses; their champions and detractors.

Buy even just one Atom PIC IC (basically just a PIC16F876 or -877 with a proprietary bootloader) for $20 and get the powerful ATOM BASIC, a processor-limited BASIC. The full blown version, known as MicroBasic Pro, from BasicMicro.com, sells for $230, and supports many 12F and 16F PIC types, but not 18Fs. ATOM BASIC supports subroutines, interrupts, 32 bit math, and the on chip hardware peripherals: USART, PWM, CCP, 10-bit ADCs, timers and clocks, etc. It also supports servo motors, LCDs, bit banged serial, I2C (master), SPI, X10, and one-wire, like the Dallas DS1820. It downloads off the serial port, then starts the program, which can now use the same port for communications it just downloaded from. No tricks, no switches.
The BasicBoard supports all these features. Hell, this exists because it is MEANT to support the features of the ATOM chip. If I remember correctly, this board was intended primarily for robotics projects. I have used it to troubleshoot serial channel problems. But, it doesn't have the breadboard, or the connectors to pick off the processor pins, which would be really nice. There are processor pins going out to headers, but I feel having female connectors would have made this much more friendly to the experimenting hobbyist.

The EZPIC4, which DOES have a hardware ICD if you can believe their claims, is, to my mind, the bargain of the century... except, once again, it has no breadboarding area. Then again, who cares? I mean, it will take dozens of PIC types, from 8 pins to 40 pins, 12Fs to 16Fs to 18Fs, and give every pin a switch, an LED and a resistor that can pull up, pull down or be turned off. It has an USB programmer built in that programs all these PICs d*mn fast. You can change crystals/resonators out, install 2x16 LCDs, 128x64 graphics LCDs, and small daughter boards supporting serial, CAN networking, RS485, RTC (Real Time Clock), and on and on. Jesus, just look at the picture of the board! And all these extra goodies are at slave labor prices. Buy the board and get their feature-packed BASIC for another $99 USD, download version.
The downside? Most of this comes from Yugoslavia, so don't expect instant delivery. Maybe two to three weeks to the US. And the BASIC is billed as the tool for knowledgeable hobbyists, minimum, more likely the professional.

The DHMicro looks interesting. I'd like to see their 28/40 pin PIC version when it comes out. I'm not real interested in C, so the C compiler they offer on their site leaves me cold. Give me BASIC. 'Just a personal thing.

Your impending board sounds like a good fit for the hobbyist or student. Do offer it up front with an LCD installed, even if the price goes up a little. Getting err and status messages in real time at the board does wonders for troubleshooting. Are you touting any high level languages for this?

If I had it to do all over again, I'd buy the EZPIC# board and the bundled license for Oshonsoft's (oshonsoft.com) two PIC BASIC compilers, for 55 Euros ($70 USD, hobbyist license). One is for dozens of 16Fs, the other for dozens of 18Fs. Both come with PC-supported simulators with virtual 7-segment displays, LCDs, analog pots, and more. To my mind, this is the least expensive, supportable path for the serious hobbyist to get max bang for the buck.

Could I be wrong? Surrre! Like I said, all these products appeal to different people. Most people start with the Stamp series from Parallax(.com) they got in school, then migrate to the Atom for its greater clock speed, internal features, and powerful BASIC. There's also the PICAXE, an ATOM lookalike; the CUBLOK, a combo processor/PLC in a module; and so on. I hadn't heard of DHMicro until this thread. And this is after three years of combing the web for PICcentric development systems, proto boards, and various (mostly BASIC) compilers. Thanks!
BTW, I don't work or know any company mentioned here, but I do own the BBoard and EZPIC#, and do like to support the equipment and software that impresses me.

Good luck, William, with Dragonfly. Please keep us up to date on this design.

kenjj

Do you mean this board? It's $119, and compared to the not yet completed Dragonfly its... The problem I have with the Basic Board and the EasyPIC4 is their "debugger" is really a simulator (done on the host computer). An true ICD uses hardware internal to the PIC and will support MPLAB.

Dragonfly Basic Board EasyPIC4
ICD2 add $45CDn bootloader programmer
MPLAB ATOM Basic proprietary
$79CDn appr $119US $119US
2x16 LCD with Backlight 2x16 LCD add $15
6 LEDs 8 LEDs 35 LEDs
12 buttons 4 buttons 36 buttons
350 breadboard prewired dip switches, jumpers
2 pots 1 pot 2 pots
Case optional no case no case

etc.............................................................................

If you want a basic compiler (a good one IMHO) with a demo version use a 16F877A and PICBASIC Pro Demo (free for 31lines of code and works with MPALB) Not sure how good ATOM Basic, what other PICs does it support? Here's a comparison table
**broken link removed**
The Basic Board would be better if sold minus the ATOM compiler, It's an 16F877A with a MAX232 (rs232) 8 LEDs, 4 Pushbuttons, speaker, LM7805, jumpers and a LCD. Should sell with the display for $50 or so. There's the DHMicro board for $109US available too.

Aside from the LCD display I'd be willing to bet I could teach as much if not more on my $69US Firefly T & Inchworm combo. If you must have an LCD you could always wire up an external 3 wire LCD circuit.
http://www.myke.com/lcd.htm

IMHO PIC demo boards with serial ports and 2x16 LCD displays are very common, even the Firefly has a serial port. The Basic Board is more a tutorial system like my Firefly is. Dragonfly is a Prototyping system. I would say the DHMicro is more along the lines of what I have in mind for Dragonfly.

**broken link removed**
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[William At MyBlueRoom]

The reason I posted was for feedback and suggestions like yours

I think solderless breadboards are very handy, and personally I want something small and hopefully competitive.
**broken link removed**

 

[tareqlover]

iwant the connections for this circuit please