Trouble with P16PRO40

[bencanon]

I just assembled a P16PRO40 programmer from Amazon electronics, and I am having trouble programming a PIC 16F628. I have never successfully used this programmer before, this being my first PIC project. I am supplying it with 17 vac from an unregulated wall wart. I am using WinPicProg, with the settings for a P16PRO40 - 7407. I get the error message " Verify failed at Program address 0x000, Programming Aborted." I have already checked VPP, and it reads as 13.1 vdc. I am new to this, and not sure what to check now. Any ideas?

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

I just assembled a P16PRO40 programmer from Amazon electronics, and I am having trouble programming a PIC 16F628. I have never successfully used this programmer before, this being my first PIC project. I am supplying it with 17 vac from an unregulated wall wart. I am using WinPicProg, with the settings for a P16PRO40 - 7407. I get the error message " Verify failed at Program address 0x000, Programming Aborted." I have already checked VPP, and it reads as 13.1 vdc. I am new to this, and not sure what to check now. Any ideas?

If you're using an unregulated wallwart, it's quite likely that it has excessive amounts of ripple on the Vpp line - this prevents the PIC entering programming mode.

Try powering it from two 9V batteries in series, I've run P16PRO40's like this for years!.

 

[williB]

I just assembled a P16PRO40 programmer from Amazon electronics, and I am having trouble programming a PIC 16F628. I have never successfully used this programmer before, this being my first PIC project. I am supplying it with 17 vac from an unregulated wall wart. I am using WinPicProg, with the settings for a P16PRO40 - 7407. I get the error message " Verify failed at Program address 0x000, Programming Aborted." I have already checked VPP, and it reads as 13.1 vdc. I am new to this, and not sure what to check now. Any ideas?

If you're using an unregulated wallwart, it's quite likely that it has excessive amounts of ripple on the Vpp line - this prevents the PIC entering programming mode.

Try powering it from two 9V batteries in series, I've run P16PRO40's like this for years!.

on the same two batteries :shock:

 

[samcheetah]

he has rechargable ones

okay bencanon does this problem come with only 18-pin devices? have you tried programming a 40-pin device? and does your programmer have a 7407 or a 7406?

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

he has rechargable ones

No! - but I work at a place that sells batteries :lol:

They last a considerable time, as long as you unplug them when not actually programming - as the batteries start to go flat, you get the same verification error - as the PIC can't be switched to programming mode.

 

[samcheetah]

lolz thats nice !!!!

i would love to work at a place where i could get free batteries.

 

[bencanon]

I tried with 2 9V batteries for the power supply, and got the same error. As for the Vregs on the programmer, I have a 78L08 and a 78L05. These were the two that I received the kit with.

I also used a borrowed JDM programmer with the same PIC, and got an error stating "Verify failed at address 0000h!" Should I try another PIC, or keep troubleshooting the programmer?

 

[samcheetah]

the PIC being bad could be a possibility. did you check the transistors before soldering them? and is the buffer IC working alright?

 

[bencanon]

Update: I have tried it with another PIC 16F628, with the same results. I also noticed that the voltage regulators are getting rather warm when I have it plugged in for >a minute or so.
I also tried to program a 16F877, but the software no longer sees the programmer. The green LED no longer lights up when the programmer is connected and has power, the Vpp40 light is the only one on.
I did not check the transistors, and I do not know how to check the buffer chip, which is a 74LS05 on this board.


I am thoroughly confused, any help would be appreciated.

EDIT: I managed to get the PC to "see" the programmer again, and it acts normally, with the green power light coming on as intended, but the error is still present with 16F877 and 12C509A chips.

 

[samcheetah]

de-solder the BC557s and check them with a transistor checker. maybe, one of them might have been damaged.

tell me when you are done with the testing

 

[bencanon]

2 have HFE readings of ~400, the other has a reading of ~350.

 

[samcheetah]

so the transistors are alright.

okay this is going to be time consuming but you have to give this a try. you have to verify the hardware functionality of each part of the programmer. take out the parallel cable out of the computer port. now start giving logic levels to the different pins on the connector and verify the logic levels created at the ZIF socket on the programmer by a logic probe (ofcourse there shouldnt be a PIC in the socket while you are doing this)

understanding the programmer is really simple. first there are buffers then there are PNP transistors. when the input to the buffers is a LOW, the base of the transistors is LOW, which means that the collector voltage is about 13 volts. if you have inverting buffers then the case would be the opposite. three of the inputs have such connections and the rest have just buffers and no driving transistors.

with your knowledge of electronics troubleshooting you can verify the functionality of the whole programmer. i think there is no other choice but to do this. only then you can trace out where the problem is. it may be the cable, it may be the resistors.

 

[panic mode]

did you measure outputs of the voltage regulators? are you sure they are connected correcly?

 

[sandeepa]

I am using WinPicProg, with the settings for a P16PRO40 - 7407.

I do not know how to check the buffer chip, which is a 74LS05 on this board.

I think you should be using the seting P16PRO40 - 7406 if you are using 74ls05 as the buffer.

 

[Superbowl64]

I just assembled a P16PRO40 programmer from Amazon electronics, and I am having trouble programming a PIC 16F628. I have never successfully used this programmer before, this being my first PIC project. I am supplying it with 17 vac from an unregulated wall wart. I am using WinPicProg, with the settings for a P16PRO40 - 7407. I get the error message " Verify failed at Program address 0x000, Programming Aborted." I have already checked VPP, and it reads as 13.1 vdc. I am new to this, and not sure what to check now. Any ideas?

I also having this problem last night when I opened my long abandoned (over 1 year!!) electronic kits drawer and picked out the writer for a new project. My programmer and software is exactly same as yours. The mpu I am working on is 16F876 (28pin PDIP). It "looks ok" on reading/erasing but does not work on writing. And at last I picked out a sand paper and file the pins of the mpu one-by-one. Now works like a charm!!

So I will suggest 2 things:
0. Check the 7406/7407 printing on one of the IC on the writer and has it set properly in Winpicprog.
1. If you are using ZIF socket (like mine), make sure the pin insertion is correct. You can tell by the middle LED on p16pro40 lighting up when really it trying to read. My 40-pin ZIF socket, unexpectedly, is found to have 41 rows......
2. If (1) looks good, pick out a piece of sand paper and try filing away the rust on the mpu tiny pins on all directions.

Hope it helps~

 

[bencanon]

I have attempted to check the logic levels on the outputs of the buffer, and I seem to have 13V to ground on pin 2, except when Vpp40 is on. I see nothing on the schematic that would indicate this being normal, but I'm not all that familiar with the schematic for this.
VDD and VPP work fine, at the intended pins.
When Output = Low, buffer pin 3 is high
When Clock = High, pin 5 is low, and pin 6 is high

Any other relationships I need to test?

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

I have attempted to check the logic levels on the outputs of the buffer, and I seem to have 13V to ground on pin 2, except when Vpp40 is on. I see nothing on the schematic that would indicate this being normal, but I'm not all that familiar with the schematic for this.
VDD and VPP work fine, at the intended pins.
When Output = Low, buffer pin 3 is high
When Clock = High, pin 5 is low, and pin 6 is high

Any other relationships I need to test?

You've got it configured incorrectly, in WinPicProg there are two fixed settings for the P16PRO40 (7406 and 7407), depending which buffer IC is fitted (one inverts, one doesn't) - either select the other P16PRO40 setting, or the custom setting and set them your self.

 

[bencanon]

My buffer appears to invert, so I would choose the 7406, right? That's how I have it set up currently. I have verified that the signals reach the socket ok, the appropriate pins ( at least as far as I know) are driven high when the outputs are on. I tried sanding the pins of the chip, and still have the same issue.

Results with correct config:
Clock high pulls pin 12 of the PIC high
Output high pulls pin 13 of the PIC high
Vdd on applies Vdd to pin 14 of the PIC
Vpp on applies 13v to pin 4 of the PIC

PC config: Getway P4 machine, running XP Pro, WinPICProg 1.91. I have the drivers installed.

I'm out of ideas, other than I've been incredibly unlucky and every single PIC I have is bad, which I sincerely doubt, as I've tried a total of 6 now, 2x628s, 2x877s, a 12C509, and a 16F84. All gave me the same error.

Anyone have any other ideas before I toss this thing out the window?

 

[eblc1388]

Results with correct config:
Clock high pulls pin 12 of the PIC high
Output high pulls pin 13 of the PIC high
Vdd on applies Vdd to pin 14 of the PIC
Vpp on applies 13v to pin 4 of the PIC

The pin numbers does not make sense to me. You have to be careful in counting the pin number. You have not told us which PIC your are trying to use in the last test.

Let start again, hopefully with some good result. The correct choice for your 74LS05 is option "7406" inside the WinPicProg software.

1. Look at the bottom right of the following image. The #7 pin on the 74LS05 is where you connect the -Ve of your meter for all voltage measurements.

Now all the following pins refer to the 40-pin ZIF socket:

2. Do your test again, without a PIC in the big ZIF socket, measure the voltages on:

Pin 1, 3, 6, 16, 23, 24, 25

It would be best to present the results using a table to show different voltages when different action performs by the WinPicPro software. If WinPicProg has hardware check function, do a check and measure a set of results.

Do you know you have to place different PICs into different locations of the ZIF socket? Just checking. I steal the picture from a thread to help you out and I hope the owner wouldn't mind.

 

[bencanon]

Thanks for the additional info. I was using a 16F628 in the previous test. I was placing it with it's pin 1 in pin 12 of the 40 pin socket, as indicated by the sheet I got with the programmer.

Pin 1 - 13V when Vpp40 is on
Pin 3 - 5v when Vdd on
Pin 6 - 13v when Vpp is on
Pin 16 - nothing, save continuity to ground
Pin 23 - high when clock is high
Pin 24 - high when output is high
Pin 25 - 5v when vdd is on

And just to clarify, is this list correct about how to insert the PICs?
40 pin PIC : pin 1 on pin 1 of socket
8 pin PIC : pin 1 on pin 3 of socket
28 pin PIC : pin 1 on pin 1 of socket
18 pin PIC : pin 1 on pin 12 of socket

Thanks again,
Ben