Remote control of multiple audio sources

[ritchie1]

I have a need for a remote audio mixer, Basicly I am trying to devise a way to do away with a Multicore cable.

My thoughts so far are either coded infrared tranmitter/receiver or RF I would like a single Xmit coded style rather than the use of multiples. The distance I am trying to acheive is approx 40 Mtrs.

the end result should be 32 line or mike sources from a stage transmitted to a remote mixing desk to be processed. for the return trip of mixed signals I am using an AV transmitter/Receiver to the power amp box.

Am i reinventing a wheel, and if not is it feasable and do the costs outweigh what I am trying to do?

are there any down sides (eg degredation of Signal ect.)

Ritchie1

ritchie_laird@bigpond.com

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

I have a need for a remote audio mixer, Basicly I am trying to devise a way to do away with a Multicore cable.

My thoughts so far are either coded infrared tranmitter/receiver or RF I would like a single Xmit coded style rather than the use of multiples. The distance I am trying to acheive is approx 40 Mtrs.

I suggest you consider the bandwidth required!.

the end result should be 32 line or mike sources from a stage transmitted to a remote mixing desk to be processed. for the return trip of mixed signals I am using an AV transmitter/Receiver to the power amp box.

Am i reinventing a wheel, and if not is it feasable and do the costs outweigh what I am trying to do?

I don't think it's practicable, it would certainly be VERY expensive to do, and you are certain to run into licencing problems - it is something I've thought about a LOT over the years, and for the same reason

are there any down sides (eg degredation of Signal ect.)

You're certainly likely to degrade the signal, and you're reducing the control you have over it - at the moment the signals enter your mixer and you have instant control over them, with either a switched or variable attenuator, to keep the levels within a sensible range. You would need to do this at the transmitter side, in order to keep the transmitted levels within the far tighter levels that the transmitter would need.

My thoughts over the years have been towards a remote controlled mixer, with the mixer on stage but digitally controlled via a wireless data system, this would overcome the problems associated with trying to send multiple audio paths wirelessly.

I've just bought a cheap small snake, 15m long and 8 inputs 4 outputs, used it for the first time yesterday, it went very well

I suggest you look what proffesionals do?, I'm sure they all use multi-way cables - wireless just isn't reliable enough, or of good enough quality. I presume you've often come across wireless mike or guitar problems, and ended up using a cable!.

 

[ritchie1]

A little more info

I currently have a 20 way 30 metre multicore. but one of the venues do not like the Idea of a 3/4" cable across the floor, even though a aluminium cable riser covers it and rubber mat on top of that, hence the need.
they are saying its a public liability issue.

mind you, I have toyed with the idea of controlling some cmos audio resistors or of kind (EG signal in through IC which opens out to 1 or so meg from what I can remember) voltage controlled resistance for want of a better description.
this could then be latched and maintained level till next poll.
mind you this would only controll volume from remote. then one would have to work out the circuitry to controll it. but this would probably do what is needed if preset tone was set prior and not needed to be changed.

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

I currently have a 20 way 30 metre multicore. but one of the venues do not like the Idea of a 3/4" cable across the floor, even though a aluminium cable riser covers it and rubber mat on top of that, hence the need.
they are saying its a public liability issue.

In which case I suggest they get the room wired accordingly!, they can hardly complain about you having to do an external cable run because they don't provide it!.

mind you, I have toyed with the idea of controlling some cmos audio resistors or of kind (EG signal in through IC which opens out to 1 or so meg from what I can remember) voltage controlled resistance for want of a better description.
this could then be latched and maintained level till next poll.
mind you this would only controll volume from remote. then one would have to work out the circuitry to controll it. but this would probably do what is needed if preset tone was set prior and not needed to be changed.

As I said before, it's a VERY complicated scheme, and is going to have much poorer quality and reliability - just get them to wire the room properly in the first place!.

How about running your exsisting cable along the wall?, that keeps it off the floor, and removes any safety problems.

 

[ritchie1]

remoye control

to the right is about 60 mtrs and to the left around 50, each side has doors,
left is main door and bridal entry and right has toilet, kitchen and outside court area entry. where I go at the moment is to the sunken dance floor around the edge to the other side and back up onto the stage.

so are you saying your Idea would also degrade the sound also.

"My thoughts over the years have been towards a remote controlled mixer, with the mixer on stage but digitally controlled via a wireless data system, this would overcome the problems associated with trying to send multiple audio paths wirelessly."

Ritchie

 

[ritchie1]

Hang on, how can resister replacing a resister "slider in the mixer" or using the insert degrade the sound?

you are replacing value for value, if I take out the 10k slider and insert the cmos resister and limit the Cmos resister to the same 10k you are saying it will degrade the sound?

I dont think so.

ritchie

 

[ritchie1]

remote controll

a simple solution,

a midi controlled mixer but make a remote control for the midi data?
that to me has some merit.

Ritchie

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

Hang on, how can resister replacing a resister "slider in the mixer" or using the insert degrade the sound?

you are replacing value for value, if I take out the 10k slider and insert the cmos resister and limit the Cmos resister to the same 10k you are saying it will degrade the sound?

I dont think so.

An electronic way of altering the gain, or the tone controls etc. isn't as high a quality as using a simple potentiometer - although if designed correctly the difference should be minimal.

Perhaps you've seen the expensive consoles where the sliders and pots are actually moved by electric motors? - allowing you to computer control the console. You can actually manually set the mixer, and store the settings - allowing you to restore them by a single button press.

Assuming you can get a MIDI run mixer then MIDI would be a fine solution.

 

[ritchie1]

Remote control midi

actually there is a company (unsure of name) that has a 8 or 16 channel mixer designed for pro tools, this mixer does just what you are saying.

so if a circuit was designed to transmit (RF or IR midi) and a second one was used remote transmitting the info, then the other one theoreticaly would mimic the first ones movements.

I think this should work.
Ritchie

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

actually there is a company (unsure of name) that has a 8 or 16 channel mixer designed for pro tools, this mixer does just what you are saying.

so if a circuit was designed to transmit (RF or IR midi) and a second one was used remote transmitting the info, then the other one theoreticaly would mimic the first ones movements.

I think this should work.

Certainly sounds plausible!.

 

[ritchie1]

Remote control midi

OK, does anyone have a circuit for remotely sending midi information via either rf or infrared.

Ritchie

 

[Dr.EM]

MIDI usually uses opto isolation. Although there are 5 pins in the sockets, its a 2 wire serial interface. Just amplify the output and send it to a powerful IR LED. The reciever is a sensor and amplifier, probably a schmitt trigger.

 

[ritchie1]

midi transmitter

OK sounds a little to simple, but I'll give it a go on my sequencer first.
do you know what pins on the midi out and midi in ports?

Ritchie