Did anyone follow the "Bail Out"?

[Space Varmint]

A majority of the Dems approved that crap back then. Realtors chimed in as well knowing they were pushing sales of inflated values, but heck, they're paid on commission so why should they turn down extra thousands in their yearly income.

I just love this guy ^^^^ You old crazy pitch fork carrying nut...lol.

Let's put it this way. If you are gonna stash something in the back yard, make sure it is real money. Not that monopoly crap. Get some gold & silver coins.

Also, burry some scrap metal in your yard so they won't know which metal detector activity is your gun or silver...lol.

Although.......I think lead could be considered a precious metal. Don't you?

 

[mneary]

30 Million mortgages a day go into default.

Huh?

Every home, paid for or not, has gone into default multiple times this week. How?

Or are you lying again?

 

[Mikebits]

Let's put blame where it is due. Sure the lenders are at fault, but do not forget the people who borrow the money.

Umm, I can't pay this month cuz I need a new SUV. Sure the lenders should have known better but what about all those chap 7 filing deadbeats. Most of these folks knew they were overextened but what the heck, they always had bankruptcy to fall back on.

Seriously... My ex-wife whom I divorced 12 years ago is just now filing chap 7, the second bankruptcy in 12 years (One reason we are no longer married) She buys and spends, builds up tons of credit, then files. Both her bankruptcies since the divorce and gets away with it, and keeps all her stuff. I dunno how she does it.

To me, it seems we need to make borrowers more accountable for their debt, and no more easy outs. I always pay my debts and so should everyone else.

If you wanna drive that big fat gas guzzlin SUV and live in the burbs impressing the Joneses, then pay for it for hecks sake, and quit expecting a free bail out. WTF...

This country is in trouble, but not all the blame goes up, it goes around IMHO.

Ok, done ranting

 

[Space Varmint]

Let's put blame where it is due. Sure the lenders are at fault, but do not forget the people who borrow the money.

Umm, I can't pay this month cuz I need a new SUV. Sure the lenders should have known better but what about all those chap 7 filing deadbeats. Most of these folks knew they were overextened but what the heck, they always had bankruptcy to fall back on.

Seriously... My ex-wife whom I divorced 12 years ago is just now filing chap 7, the second bankruptcy in 12 years (One reason we are no longer married) She buys and spends, builds up tons of credit, then files. Both her bankruptcies since the divorce and gets away with it, and keeps all her stuff. I dunno how she does it.

To me, it seems we need to make borrowers more accountable for their debt, and no more easy outs. I always pay my debts and so should everyone else.

If you wanna drive that big fat gas guzzlin SUV and live in the burbs impressing the Joneses, then pay for it for hecks sake, and quit expecting a free bail out. WTF...

This country is in trouble, but not all the blame goes up, it goes around IMHO.

Ok, done ranting

Yeah but think about it. Let's say a man is starving and I a wave a freshly broiled tender loin stake under his nose. You don't think 9 times out of ten he will go for it?

It's not the poor little borrower who just wants a meager home for his family. It's those who are in control of the financial money market.

 

[Torben]

Yeah but think about it. Let's say a man is starving and I a wave a freshly broiled tender loin stake under his nose. You don't think 9 times out of ten he will go for it?

It's not the poor little borrower who just wants a meager home for his family. It's those who are in control of the financial money market.

I suspect Mike *did* think about it. He's not talking about the guy who needs to borrow because it's a matter of shelter and sustenance. He's talking about Joe Wannabe who buys far more than he can afford--huge house, huge vehicle, huge TV, etc.

"Hey, did you see Joe in that Escalade? He does phone support. How can he afford that?"
"He can't."
"Oh."

If you let people spend more than they can afford, often they will. Zero down, don't pay for two years, and low monthly payments are a tantalizing combination of lures for some people, especially in a culture like ours that rewards style over substance.


Torben

 

[Mikebits]

I suspect Mike *did* think about it. He's not talking about the guy who needs to borrow because it's a matter of shelter and sustenance. He's talking about Joe Wannabe who buys far more than he can afford--huge house, huge vehicle, huge TV, etc.

"Hey, did you see Joe in that Escalade? He does phone support. How can he afford that?"
"He can't."
"Oh."

If you let people spend more than they can afford, often they will. Zero down, don't pay for two years, and low monthly payments are a tantalizing combination of lures for some people, especially in a culture like ours that rewards style over substance.


Torben

Exactly...

 

[3v0]

Follow the money and the votes !

Wages have not kept up with inflation and government has underplayed it. Anyone one a fixed income can tell you that the inflation numbers are bogus.

In an effort to maintain lifestyle people start spending more then they earn. In time the percentage of income going to interest grows.

The population was an easy mark for the credit vultures. As Mikebits pointed out some maybe all were being stupid, but it an understandable sort of stupid.

Had the republicrats not allowed the easy credit people would have been upset with their reduced standard of living and that would have cost votes.

3v0

 

[Torben]

Wages have not kept up with inflation and government has underplayed it. Anyone one a fixed income can tell you that the inflation numbers are bogus.

In an effort to maintain lifestyle people start spending more then they earn. In time the percentage of income going to interest grows.

The population was an easy mark for the credit vultures. As Mikebits pointed out some maybe all were being stupid, but it an understandable sort of stupid.

Had the republicrats not allowed the easy credit people would have been upset with their reduced standard of living and that would have cost votes.

3v0

I do agree with just about everything you say. I don't find it all that understandable that people are willing to put luxuries before family security, but I agree that people are generally unwilling to give up luxuries. It would have been an easy trap to fall into, yes.

I find it sad and disgusting that politicians are willing to put votes before the good of the nation they serve. Sadly it's kind of an almost inevitable side effect of how the electoral systems are set up in Canada and the U.S. (not the same systems, but neither system is exactly optimal).


Torben

 

[Mikebits]

Had the republicrats not allowed the easy credit people would have been upset with their reduced standard of living and that would have cost votes.

The house majority is democrats. Is that what you mean by republicrats? Fixed income may soon be a thing of the past as SS is going broke. I am reaching fixed income age and I doubt there will be a pot to pee in...

 

[3v0]

The house majority is democrats. Is that what you mean by republicrats? Fixed income may soon be a thing of the past as SS is going broke. I am reaching fixed income age and I doubt there will be a pot to pee in...

Agreeded but SS is not the only source of fixed income. People living on pensions and insurance settlements also fall into this basket.

Republican + Democrat = Repubicrats

There is a difference between them. But either way we loose.

 

[3v0]

Devil's advocate time

Since you take neither money of debt with you when you die it makes sense to spend all you can earn, borrow, beg, or in general lay your hands on.

People feel they work hard and are entitled to their "expected" standard of living. The expected standard of living is a product of many things. It is different for each of us, but it is there.

I knew a nice otherwise sharp EE. At one point he purchased a motor home that cost more then my house. Why? Because it was expected that an engineer near the end of his career should have one. Never mind the fact that he could not afford to go out for lunch with the rest of us.

One problem is that as you start earning more so do the people you associate with. You do the same work and expect to have what they have. The shrinking income problem compounds this.

If you learn to be happy with less then your co-workers have you can put away a bit of money. That is until divorce, lawyers, stock market, health problems, or whatever bites you in the back side. If these things chew up you hard earned money you may well have wished you squandered it.

3v0

I do agree with just about everything you say. I don't find it all that understandable that people are willing to put luxuries before family security, but I agree that people are generally unwilling to give up luxuries. It would have been an easy trap to fall into, yes.

I find it sad and disgusting that politicians are willing to put votes before the good of the nation they serve. Sadly it's kind of an almost inevitable side effect of how the electoral systems are set up in Canada and the U.S. (not the same systems, but neither system is exactly optimal).


Torben

 

[Torben]

Since you take neither money of debt with you when you die it makes sense to spend all you can earn, borrow, beg, or in general lay your hands on.

People feel they work hard and are entitled to their "expected" standard of living. The expected standard of living is a product of many things. It is different for each of us, but it is there.

I knew a nice otherwise sharp EE. At one point he purchased a motor home that cost more then my house. Why? Because it was expected that an engineer near the end of his career should have one. Never mind the fact that he could not afford to go out for lunch with the rest of us.

One problem is that as you start earning more so do the people you associate with. You do the same work and expect to have what they have. The shrinking income problem compounds this.

If you learn to be happy with less then your co-workers have you can put away a bit of money. That is until divorce, lawyers, stock market, health problems, or whatever bites you in the back side. If these things chew up you hard earned money you may well have wished you squandered it.

3v0

True. Even easier, if you don't start to think that you need more than you can afford to start with. I've financed a couple of larger purchases, but I have never felt the need to spend money I don't have to satisfy my peers. I can say that everything I have, I own. I am aware that this is not common. My divorce was also amicable, thankfully. Not that she could have taken me for much at the time anyway.


Torben

 

[Mikebits]

If you learn to be happy with less then your co-workers have you can put away a bit of money. That is until divorce, lawyers, stock market, health problems, or whatever bites you in the back side. If these things chew up you hard earned money you may well have wished you squandered it.

True friends will not care where you live. Choose freinds wisely and spend wisely. Living beyond ones means is poor behaviour.

 

[Torben]

True friends will not care where you live. Choose freinds wisely and spend wisely. Living beyond ones means is poor behaviour.

Exactly.


Torben

 

[Mikebits]

Allow me to comment yet once again and thanks for indulging me

My ex is like an addict, she always needs more; shop, shop, shop. She has to have it all. The credit system has been her pimp and has acted as a enzyme or enabler if you will. The enabler is as to blame as the addict, but be that as it may, we have a credit epidemic as this problem is statewide.

Perhaps this financial collapse is a good thing as it may bring the family unit closer by necessity, and hard work becomes commonplace once again. When this occurs, maybe family values and perspective of what is important will once again appear...

 

[Torben]

Allow me to comment yet once again and thanks for indulging me

My ex is like an addict, she always needs more; shop, shop, shop. She has to have it all. The credit system has been her pimp and has acted as a enzyme or enabler if you will. The enabler is as to blame as the addict, but be that as it may, we have a credit epidemic as this problem is statewide.

Perhaps this financial collapse is a good thing as it may bring the family unit closer by necessity, and hard work becomes commonplace once again. When this occurs, maybe family values and perspective of what is important will once again appear...

Fingers crossed.


Torben

 

[HarveyH42]

The bankers aren't stupid, they are highly educated. They were well aware of any and all risks. They knew they would still come out disgustingly rich, no matter what happened as a result. When we gamble, sometimes we lose the wager, even when we do our homework, and try to ensure that we don't. Professionals understand sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, but there are ways to minimize your loses. These guys crying for help, are professionals, they would never have take such huge risks, or relied on market trends. These guys aren't looking at assets, only profits.
How many people can actually read through a credit/loan contract, start to finish, and understand every word? I usually don't make it through the first page or two. It's written very deliberately, a lot of though and planning goes into every word. These people don't just pass out the cash, and hope to get most of it back, with a little extra for their trouble. It's their business to turn a profit on every deal, regardless of how it gets done.

 

[HiTech]

Originally Posted by HiTech
A majority of the Dems approved that crap back then.

I just love this guy ^^^^ You old crazy pitch fork carrying nut...lol.

It's true! Obama gained from it, for example.

 

[Space Varmint]

I suspect Mike *did* think about it. He's not talking about the guy who needs to borrow because it's a matter of shelter and sustenance. He's talking about Joe Wannabe who buys far more than he can afford--huge house, huge vehicle, huge TV, etc.

"Hey, did you see Joe in that Escalade? He does phone support. How can he afford that?"
"He can't."
"Oh."

If you let people spend more than they can afford, often they will. Zero down, don't pay for two years, and low monthly payments are a tantalizing combination of lures for some people, especially in a culture like ours that rewards style over substance.


Torben

Still hanging on to delusion...Well your in Canada but it still effects you because the US dollar is the world currency. What just happened is, Goldman Sax has just been given dictatorial powers on paper.

 

[Mikebits]

Still hanging on to delusion...Well your in Canada but it still effects you because the US dollar is the world currency. What just happened is, Goldman Sax has just been given dictatorial powers on paper.

Why must you persist with this predilection to throwing out insults? Is your argument so weak that you must resort to this tactic?