contemplating changing code language

[Jon Wilder]

calm down jon your gettinbg yourself in a twist over nothing. i never mentioned you i certainly didnt argue the point that to understand ASM you need to get into the hardware. what i DID say and stand by is you dont have to the ASM route if you want to get deep into the datasheets and hardware you can also do that in C. dont try and start something with me for no reason. be as condescending as you like to me tho

While you still have to reference the data sheets in C, it does not go AS DEEP into the hardware as assembly language does. For instance, on 16F PICs you have to understand things like RAM bank selecting, memory paging, and page boundaries. In C the compiler handles all of this for you. You also get into things like indirect addressing in assembly that you don't do in C. Therefore, my statement does in fact "hold water".

 

[MrDEB]

for a programmer I have a Junebug. Seems to work better w/o the 18F1320 inserted.
If I go with C do I need a different compiler than MPLAB?
Swordfish is good but feel I am missing the basics of pic programming plus I can't usn anything other than an 18F pic. Have a project that it was suggested to use the 10F200.
I really would like to get the basic's of programming as I feel I am missing out on something?

 

[MrDEB]

I truied looking at tutorial 1 in C but have yet to figure out how to open an ASM file?

 

[Ian Rogers]

ASM files can be opened in wordpad or notepad.... Indeed any text viewer...

If you ever look through my C tutorials.. If you find any typo's or "Bad" commenting... Please let me know.....

 

[3v0]

for a programmer I have a Junebug. Seems to work better w/o the 18F1320 inserted.
If I go with C do I need a different compiler than MPLAB?
Swordfish is good but feel I am missing the basics of pic programming plus I can't usn anything other than an 18F pic. Have a project that it was suggested to use the 10F200.
I really would like to get the basic's of programming as I feel I am missing out on something?

You have not missed anything of real value. ASM in not the basics of programming. It is different for each architecture and generally the compiler will do a better job of taking care of the house keeping and other low level stuff that has zip to do with the program you are trying to implement. We use HLL's for a reason and it is not because we are incapable of using ASM.

If you want to learn something useful grab a book on data structures.

MPLAB is not a compiler it is the development environment, it allows you to get to the editor/debugger/compiler tools from one interface. If you want to work with several PIC families try the hi-tech compiler.

Looks like microchip is messing with the compilers again. Not sure what we will end up with.

 

[Mike - K8LH]

If you want to work with several PIC families try the hi-tech compiler.

I would only recommend the free version of the Hi-Tech compiler to someone I don't like (grin)...

 

[DirtyLude]

I just started working with HI-TECH and it's been pretty good as it is, except the limitations on the free version. I'm interested in alternatives. I've been spoiled by development environments for other uC's.

MrDEB: All I've used is MPLAB-X, but HI-TECH just plugs right in and you compile and debug right from there. It's pretty straight forward.

 

[nickelflippr]

for a programmer I have a Junebug. Seems to work better w/o the 18F1320 inserted.
If I go with C do I need a different compiler than MPLAB?
Swordfish is good but feel I am missing the basics of pic programming plus I can't usn anything other than an 18F pic. Have a project that it was suggested to use the 10F200.
I really would like to get the basic's of programming as I feel I am missing out on something?

Cow Basic, as Burt calls it , will do the 10F PICs. I think doing a project with the 10F200 could prove instructive. It will force you to conserve variables and program memory. That means hitting the data sheet, leaving behind built in compiler commands, and most likely substituting asm instructions and poking registers directly instead.

 

[Ian Rogers]

I would only recommend the free version of the Hi-Tech compiler to someone I don't like (grin)...

I tend to agree here..... I wanted to buy the full version, the updates are available if you buy the HPA every year....The speed that micro's are coming out... You HAVE to keep it up to date..... The lite version doubles ram usage AND constant tables.... I know its free, but the limitations make it useless as a learning tool. The tutorials that I converted are VERY close to full usage... it should be at least 30% smaller with no optimization at all...

 

[be80be]

I don't see MrDeb using C anything and all this is about is to use 10f200 chips which is a waste of time even thinking about learning some thing else and the code MrDeb would need wouldn't be more then 40 lines of ASM. There are some cheap 18f chips that would let you use Swordfish.

Think about this MrDeb what do you want to do make something them boy scout's can use or spend your time figuring how to code in this or that language .
In the last four years or so I have not seen any code you can truly say you did by yourself. Now don't think I'm picking on you here. You sent me a Email asking the same thing you posted here and did you send a reply No you didn't you jump at to many dead ideas which makes it hard to learn anything.

I'm now fully bald from the last time I looked at some LCD code that worked tried for some time to get you to make sure you had the hardware hooked up right I new the code was right It worked fine on my LCD but you keep changing it and in the end It was your hardware wired wrong.

Why start over a ground level and if that's what you want then learn ASM it's going to take time. I don't no if you remember I posted you some code in PIC BASIC PRO that did every thing you wanted you didn't think it worked because it was less then 20 lines. Point is it's easy to do a lot in PBP in a few lines so many built in commands. GreatCow is easy to use to just not as much built in commands.

Bottom Line things don't have to be hard to work, You don't need 500 line to read a switch and blink your led's left or right and hold the brake and show a stop light.

I wish you would think about all this and Hobby would be less headaches and a lot more fun.

 

[Jon Wilder]

In the last four years or so I have not seen any code you can truly say you did by yourself.

How so?

 

[MrDEB]

I thought I emailed you back Burt?o My bad
Sounds like a whole new can of worms just to transmit the status of two switches.May just stick to Swordfish for now. I have yet to try using the 7555 idea which IMO will work IF I get a loop that counts the number of pulses in say 1 second. If less than 50 then switch one if more than 100 then switch two. By having a large gap between the pulse count then any glitches wouldn't matter hopefully?
Been kinda busy lately with wood projects but really kinda depressed or anxious about forth coming back surgery. Can't seem to get enthused to do anything at this point.
Sorry if I sound like I am looking for pity. I figured while laying in a hospital bed I could read up on XXX code

 

[be80be]

Jon I didn't say you ok! This is about MrDeb he loves making things for the Boy scouts. I don't think he needs to be talked into a mess. If he want's to learn ASM then that's great but not needed.

He can use basic Oshonsoft is cheap and some what like Swordfish. I know MrDeb not face to face but any one who spends there time helping young men become men has my help. This is why I think he needs to figure where to spend this time Great people can't do it all but no where to find the help they need.

I remember the first time i wrote code it was basic made some sounds with it on the computer a whopping fast 2 mhz TR80 that plugged into the Tv. Black and white I saved my money and got a color TV that had the RGB plugs for it started drawing with code lot's of fun. Work took me away from all that then I got laid off and started playing with Pbasic and the stamp. Then came the PIC and ASM I had to learn it glade I did use it but basic what I no best I stayed with it and the more I do the more I learn. But now after five years I can see how C is coded and I've used a bunch.

Pic Arm atmel used C on all them, but Basic is what helped get there and Mike and 3v0 and Nigel all showed me a lot of things

That's why I hope Mrdeb stays with basic and learns that well enough to see how even the rest work and not jump into something just because billy bob said so and waste time he could use for something else

 

[.W4GNS]

Been kinda busy lately with wood projects but really kinda depressed or anxious about forth coming back surgery.

I have had 3 in 2 1/2 years, PM me and I can prolly talk you out of that jazz. Sorry for the OT

 

[be80be]

Does back surgery even work my Doc said it would make it better and Guy that did the MRI said forget and live with the pain or do it and have more pain.

I figure just forget it and live with it but it's hard to set in my chair and code now and I'm not big on pain meds Hope you get better and good luck Mrdeb.

 

[3v0]

MrDeb see if you can find a book on data structures as I mentioned earlier. Maybe the public lib? I think you stand a better chance of getting something useful out of your bedrest time reading it. All attempts I made a coding while on serious pain meds were a flop.

Given that everyone seems to have had their say on the language thing I think it would be OK to talk about the back thing unless MrDeb objects? And if he does we can start a new thread.

Not sure what your back problem is Burt.

I have a few ruptured and a few compressed disks. After about a year of trying to not lift much and 2 months of PT most of the pain is gone, unless I get stupid and lift something. The PT did more good then anything as it built up muscles to support the spine.

From what I read natural healing takes 3 to 5 years.

 

[be80be]

You hit the nail on the head about not lifting any thing that's heavy. That's what did it and that's what I need to do stop being stupid I'm not a kid any more even if I think I am sometimes mine are compressed

And 3v0 the data structures would be a great book to read

 

[.W4GNS]

1/3 of mine are now artificial + Titanium cage , Doc told me to start drinking after the fact of doing all that. Go figure

 

[MrDEB]

I have several compressed discs but the problem at this point is L1 is compressing the spinal cord canal. On June 7th they are going to do a lumbar laminectomy.
At present I have no real pain just numbness in the legs after standing for 5-10 minutes
any suggestions on books on data structures as I need to order from Amazon.com
Got up this morning at 3am. can't sleep. Thinking about how to recalibrate the temp ctr soldering iron I built seeing how I got the Hakko temperature meter. Along with that how to do the switch polling idea using the 7555. Ideas are just working overtime since I found out my diagnosis. I knew this was coming 5 years ago. The legs have just got worse as far as stamina goes. On top of all this I am still contemplating going to summer camp with my BSA troop on the 18th 11 days after sugery. YES I am working on an alternative plan.

 

[misterT]

What happened to this thread?