Cheap PCB's from JLC PCB, including cheap postage.

[Nigel Goodwin]

There's often been mention of the price of PCB's from the Chinese manufacturers, in this case JLC PCB.

Now while the boards are cheap (and excellent quality), the cost of getting them from China isn't

I order quite a lot of boards from work, and I've recently used the last of the hundred boards I last ordered for one of our products, so took the opportunity to change the board slightly - as such, I only ordered 5 boards to test, rather than 100 to find out I've messed up, and the boards are useless.

The boards are well under their 100mm x 100mm special offer price of $2, so it seemed a shame to pay $20+ to get them delivered.

Normally we pay for DHL delivery, because we like them to arrive quickly (usually a week from order, or even 5/6 days), but in this case there's no rush, as we're already waiting for other parts, and we've got a stock of 'mostly' built units waiting for those parts. So I went for the cheapest delivery offered - although this only seems available on low cost, or perhaps low weight?, orders.

So this is the actual cost, cut and pasted from the invoice at JLC PCB.

Merchandise Total: USD $2.00 (￡1.58)

Shipping: USD $1.55 (￡1.22)

Subtotal: USD $3.55 (￡2.80)

Import Taxes(20%): USD $0.71 (￡0.56)

Grand Total: USD $4.26 (￡3.36)

So, £3.36 for 5 boards delivered from China, including UK VAT paid (20%), you can't really grumble at that

I placed the order on 8th November, and according to the tracking they are in the UK, have cleared customs, and are in the hands of the local carrier, I imagine they will arrive tomorrow, or even this afternoon.

For a comparison, the 100 similar boards I ordered previously cost this:

Merchandise Total: USD $52.10 (￡41.04)

Shipping: USD $67.32 (￡53.03)

Subtotal: USD $119.42 (￡94.07)

Import Taxes(20%): USD $23.89 (￡18.82)

Grand Total: USD $143.31 (￡112.89)

To be fair, that works out at £1.13 per board, compared to £0.67 per board for the 5 on the special offer with slow postage. It is annoying though when the postage is more than the goods

 

[For The Popcorn]

I've had pretty good success with their low cost shipping options. Sometimes it does seem to take forever from "in your country –:being transferred to postal service" and the postal service receiving the package.

But.... compare the cost of 5 boards with DLI shipping to having the boards made domestically. Even with expensive shipping, the difference with be substantial! Last time I looked, to get the per board cost about the same, I'd have to order more than 500 boards locally.

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

I've had pretty good success with their low cost shipping options. Sometimes it does seem to take forever from "in your country –:being transferred to postal service" and the postal service receiving the package.

But.... compare the cost of 5 boards with DLI shipping to having the boards made domestically. Even with expensive shipping, the difference with be substantial! Last time I looked, to get the per board cost about the same, I'd have to order more than 500 boards locally.

When I first started working where I do now, one of my first projects was to redesign the PCB for this same unit - I'd originally done a rough PCB design at home, for this unit, which I'd designed entirely at home. Gave all the files to my friend (now my boss as well) and told him to modify the PCB files as required, as we didn't even have the LCD module at the time.

So when I started working for him, I discovered he'd just used the PCB design exactly as I'd originally created it - so I said "well I'm not building those"

So my first job was redoing the PCB, and moving to Designspark from the (cheap and nasty) program he's given me to use for the original prototype.

So next I asked where do we get the boards made?, and he gave me the email address for the UK company he'd used - this was on Monday (my first day), so I emailed the gerbers off and asked for a quote and delivery time. However, I mentioned to him that I'd seen an advert a few days earlier for cheap PCB's from JLC PCB, so we sent an order off to them as well, for the cheap 5 boards special offer.

The UK company didn't even send us a quote until later on in the week, and the delivery time was weeks, not days - meanwhile, JLC had already manufactured the boards, and they were on the way to us. Their prices were also considerably more expensive than JLC PCB - so needless to say, we've continued to use JLC PCB for all our PCB requirements.

The postal service in the UK is usually very good, although it does vary somewhat regionally (down south can be quite bad), the JLC PCB boards usually come via either The Post Office, or Evri (a bit of a crap courier company), but either are generally pretty fast.

 

[augustinetez]

I made the mistake of selecting DHL for a pcb delivery back in the beginning of getting them from China.

Because I live "out of town", they charged me an extra "remote delivery fee" that was double that of the cost of shipping from China and they took longer than if I had just got them posted regular mail.

Now I use EMS if I need them quicker (and at much less cost than DHL).

 

[ian.herh]

In such cases, you've met those suppliers who use very competitive price to attack you to order, they often over promise you the quality or service. There are many factories (not all of them) do it this way while I don't encourage them to do business like this.

Price is the key element to buyers but not the one and only.

 

[For The Popcorn]

JLCPCB is a quality company, as is Elecrow (personal experience).

The major differences for me:

JLC has flat-black soldermask at no extra charge. Flat-black is great for making instrument panels.

Elecrow does not charge extra for v-scoring a number of copies of the same board on a panel – if you have a small board, you can fit a number of copies on a 100mm × 100mm board for the usual $5 charge. The individual boards snap apart when flexed.

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

I made the mistake of selecting DHL for a pcb delivery back in the beginning of getting them from China.

Because I live "out of town", they charged me an extra "remote delivery fee" that was double that of the cost of shipping from China and they took longer than if I had just got them posted regular mail.

Now I use EMS if I need them quicker (and at much less cost than DHL).

Well that's a bummer How far out of town are you?, I realise in the US 'out of town' could be a substantial distance.

I was talking to the DHL driver who usually delivers our PCB's the other week, he's a cool guy, shorts, piercings and tattoos - and I happened to mention that he was fairly 'early', slightly before the estimated delivery window. He replied that it was because he ignored the stupid order the DHL system had placed them in.

His theory is that it places them based simply on 'as the crow flies' distances, with no concern if there's a road there or not.

Assuming five drops, where we're number 2, and the one before would be 1, he did the drops in numerical order, as that's the obvious route based on where they were, and where the roads are. The system wanted him to do this order - 1, 4, 3, 2, 5 - so he'd drive past 2 & 3 on the way to 4, then drive back down the same road to do 3 & 2, then drive back past 3 & 4 on the way to 5, utter stupidity, but as he's been coming for years and years, he knows the best way to do the drops.

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

Oh, just checked the tracking, it still says the exact same thing as yesterday - dated 18th at 7:30 in the morning:

Outward MC - Handheld Acceptance,PSC South East

I must admit, I'm not very sure what that actually means

I presume MC is 'Mail Centre'?, and PSC is 'Postal Sorting Office', and South East is where it landed, an airport near London (usually Heathrow).

 

[augustinetez]

Well that's a bummer How far out of town are you?, I realise in the US 'out of town' could be a substantial distance.

About 190km from Adelaide (in South Australia).

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

About 190km from Adelaide (in South Australia).

Well I can see why they charge extra for that

For perspective, I live fairly close to one of the places in England that claims to be the geographical centre of the country (it's a tree at the side of the road in Morton) - so I'm pretty well as far from the sea as it's possible to be.

It's about 100km

 

[MrAl]

There's often been mention of the price of PCB's from the Chinese manufacturers, in this case JLC PCB.

Now while the boards are cheap (and excellent quality), the cost of getting them from China isn't

I order quite a lot of boards from work, and I've recently used the last of the hundred boards I last ordered for one of our products, so took the opportunity to change the board slightly - as such, I only ordered 5 boards to test, rather than 100 to find out I've messed up, and the boards are useless.

The boards are well under their 100mm x 100mm special offer price of $2, so it seemed a shame to pay $20+ to get them delivered.

Normally we pay for DHL delivery, because we like them to arrive quickly (usually a week from order, or even 5/6 days), but in this case there's no rush, as we're already waiting for other parts, and we've got a stock of 'mostly' built units waiting for those parts. So I went for the cheapest delivery offered - although this only seems available on low cost, or perhaps low weight?, orders.

So this is the actual cost, cut and pasted from the invoice at JLC PCB.



So, £3.36 for 5 boards delivered from China, including UK VAT paid (20%), you can't really grumble at that

I placed the order on 8th November, and according to the tracking they are in the UK, have cleared customs, and are in the hands of the local carrier, I imagine they will arrive tomorrow, or even this afternoon.

For a comparison, the 100 similar boards I ordered previously cost this:



To be fair, that works out at £1.13 per board, compared to £0.67 per board for the 5 on the special offer with slow postage. It is annoying though when the postage is more than the goods

Hi there Nigel,

Things may change here in the US with the new change in leadership. We may end up with more import taxes which would affect all of these kinds of purchases.
Personally, I haven't ordered any boards from across any ocean because I haven't gotten around to figuring out the format for the files they want to use, but maybe you have a website that can explain that I can check out. I'd like to be able to get some custom-made boards too as I do not like making my own at home anymore.

The import taxes are to level out the playing field for us here in the US but it will cost more for us eventually. I order a lot of other stuff that comes from across the oceans, so it's going to hit me personally too.

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

Hi there Nigel,

Things may change here in the US with the new change in leadership. We may end up with more import taxes which would affect all of these kinds of purchases.
Personally, I haven't ordered any boards from across any ocean because I haven't gotten around to figuring out the format for the files they want to use, but maybe you have a website that can explain that I can check out. I'd like to be able to get some custom-made boards too as I do not like making my own at home anymore.

The import taxes are to level out the playing field for us here in the US but it will cost more for us eventually. I order a lot of other stuff that comes from across the oceans, so it's going to hit me personally too.

They just want gerber files, the standard that all PCB programs provide. They even have their own free program you can use, either on-line, or as a download. Personally I use DesignSpark PCB, which is free from RS - depending which version you want to use, but the free version is fine for me (it's now a subscription based model, but there's a free subscription version).

 

[schmitt trigger]

JLCPCB is a quality company, as is Elecrow (personal experience).

The major differences for me:

JLC has flat-black soldermask at no extra charge. Flat-black is great for making instrument panels.

I have also used JLCPB to create instrument panels. The aluminum substrate is excellent for panels which require additional strength that a regular FR4 can’t provide. The brushed aluminum looks great too!

 

[For The Popcorn]

I didn't realize aluminum boards were so cheap – I just had a look at JLC and they're not hugely expensive. At 50mm × 75mm that I was looking at for something else, 5 aluminum panels are $20. Ten takes the cost up to $21.60.

 

[schmitt trigger]

The import taxes are to level out the playing field for us here in the US but it will cost more for us eventually. I order a lot of other stuff that comes from across the oceans, so it's going to hit me personally too.

To "level the field", it would require an effort similar to leveling a whole mountain to fill up a valley.

ExpressPCB, which I used for almost 20 years, the only decent service it offers is the Miniboard Pro service, which consists of:

• 3 boards of 2-layer, with a fixed size of 96.5 X 63.5 mm
• No cutouts or slots or shapes other than rectangular.
• Silkscreen only on a single layer.
• No electrical test.
• Pb-HASL the only available surface finish.
• Only green color available for the soldermask.
• Only 1oz copper.
• Minimum hole thickness 0.15mm
• Only 0.060" thick FR4 substrate.
• No plugged via options, nor NPTH options.
• No castellated holes nor edge plating.
• All of this for US $78 plus $26.73 ground shipping, for a total of $104.73 !!!!!

If I go for JLCPCB, and select a board with the same essential construction, I get:

• 5 boards variable dimensions up to 100X100mm
• The ExpressPCB constraints are non-existent, and are either no-cost options (electrical test slots, plugged vias, both side silkscreen, several substrate thicknesses, smaller holes) or may be had for a moderate price (copper weight, soldermask colors, substrate material, advanced finishing).
• The price is US $2.00 for the boards plus $1.52 slow shipping for a total of $$3.52; Even if I select UPSExpress, it is only $18.06 for the shipping and I will still get them earlier than ExpressPCB outrageous ground shipping.

To me, the JLCPCB vs ExpressPCB is the poster child of the China vs USA manufacturing conundrum. Not only there is an abysmal cost difference which cannot be solely filled up with tariffs, but their service and capabilities are at a far, far superior level.
The tariffs will be crippling..... for US consumers.

 

[ronsimpson]

I am in the USA. Compare JLCPCB and a local company 40 miles away.
DHL from China is about the same as FedEx 40 miles.
China makes the boards much cheaper.
I get my boards with the parts on the boards. Much much cheaper.

If the order is below some unknown amount (maybe $400) it comes as a hobby project.
Sometimes I slip and the price is $600 and customs tacks on 30%. (don't remember the exact amount)
Now with Trump there might be another 30% I have to pay. This does not hurt China and I am willing to pay 60% to the government. (not happy)

 

[ZipZapOuch]

Things may change here in the US with the new change in leadership. We may end up with more import taxes which would affect all of these kinds of purchases.

The new administration is planning to raise the 31% tariff* on the $2 for 5 PCBs to 66%*.
So, $2.62 landed price currently (plus freight (no tariff on freight)).
To $3.32 landed price. That makes it completely unaffordable and I'm sure PCB shops will start popping up all across the US soon [/sarcasm]

* current tariff is 6% standard on unpopulated PCBs plus 25% China tariff that Trump put in place and Biden never repealed.
** new tariff will be 6% plus 60% new tariff.

 

[For The Popcorn]

I have also used JLCPB to create instrument panels. The aluminum substrate is excellent for panels which require additional strength that a regular FR4 can’t provide. The brushed aluminum looks great too!

Aluminum boards I've seen have tracks, soldemask and silkscreen on one side and the other is bare aluminum on the other. Will they silkscreen the bare side?

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

I am in the USA. Compare JLCPCB and a local company 40 miles away.
DHL from China is about the same as FedEx 40 miles.
China makes the boards much cheaper.
I get my boards with the parts on the boards. Much much cheaper.

If the order is below some unknown amount (maybe $400) it comes as a hobby project.
Sometimes I slip and the price is $600 and customs tacks on 30%. (don't remember the exact amount)
Now with Trump there might be another 30% I have to pay. This does not hurt China and I am willing to pay 60% to the government. (not happy)

Over here we get 20% VAT added, although if it's less than about £20 it usually gets through without been charged - however, for this low cost shipping option you don't get the option not to pre-pay the VAT.

 

[ZipZapOuch]

Over here we get 20% VAT added, although if it's less than about £20 it usually gets through without been charged - however, for this low cost shipping option you don't get the option not to pre-pay the VAT.

Here the limit used to be $800 but Temu and other Chinese discounters have pushed the US to drop that cutoff to a new, random value. I don't know how low they go now. Some packages for $10 are getting into the system. I can't imaging collecting $4 justifies the paperwork but, eh, I don't make the rules.