300-400 MHz microcontroler with starter kit?

[insight]

Hi,

I have Arduino and it runs on 20 MHz. But I need something similar, that would take C language programs, but will run around 300 to 400 MHz.

Is there a microprocessor / micro controller that runs at that speed but that still has the same developer friendly environment, with C code libraries etc.?

 

[erendesh]

Hi,

I have Arduino and it runs on 20 MHz. But I need something similar, that would take C language programs, but will run around 300 to 400 MHz.

Is there a microprocessor / micro controller that runs at that speed but that still has the same developer friendly environment, with C code libraries etc.?

This question sounds like, I have a 1.6L Toyota Corolla but I want something with with Turbo 3L engine ( which will be something like Porsche or Audi) but that is cheap and easy to operate.
So far as I know Texas Instruments C2000 to C6000 processor can run from 80MHz to 300MHz. You will need Code Compressor Studio to run than with bit expensive JTAG ( 510 or 550 jtag). As you need it is C interface but not as simple as Arduino. You will have to work more with Interrupts and timing. Or Blackfin processor from Analog Devices.

The other alternative for you is to get into FPGA. If you choose FPGA like Altera's Cyclone II, you can run NIOS micro controller in it and for your intended 300MHz to 500MHz task you can extract grunt of Logic( using VERILOG or AHDL).

I hope this helps....
Regards,
Sandesh

 

[Sceadwian]

It would help more if we knew what you were doing that you thought you needed that kind of speed.
Arm processors come to mind, they go up into the low Ghz range, just search Google for Arm Modules. There is an extensive amount of development out there for Arm based boards.

 

[insight]

I want to do a laser rangefinder. To get 1m accuracy, you need 330 MHz, even with phase shift method.

 

[DirtyLude]

I would think the interval timing you would want to do outside of the microcontroller. Everything I know of in the 300Mhz and up range is meant to run small operating systems and gets fairly expensive.

 

[insight]

how can one time the ultra fast event and deliver that time as a number / voltage etc to slower microprocessor?

 

[EternityForest]

what about using a very fast digital counter fed by a fast crystal oscillator. when you send a pulse reset the counter, and when you receive a pulse check it.

 

[insight]

Oh EternityForest you are my savor!


What is this "fast digital counter fed by a fast crystal oscillator"? Can you pint me towards some practical example? What are these things usually called, so I can google it?

 

[insight]

I googled "digital counter" and "ic 300 MHz digital counter" and got a bunch of oscilloscopes. Can you please give me some ideas for keywords to dig out some "digital counter ICs".

 

[dknguyen]

how can one time the ultra fast event and deliver that time as a number / voltage etc to slower microprocessor?

You should be aware though that a laser rangefinder (one that works off the basis of time of flight at least) is beyond the capabilities of almost any hobbyist (even more sure for someone asking general questions on a forum).

An ultrasonic rangefinder is much hobbyist-feasible.

THat said, one approach is by doing as much as possible in the analog domain and converting the data to a "low speed form" and then transferring that low speed data to an MCU. Because even the fastest processor would be unlikely to keep up (let alone one you'd actually be able to mount on a board and figure out how to use). One idea is to have a pulse whose time is the length of time between the transmit and receive and then stretch that pulse out long enough so that it can be easily measured by a slower processor.

Take this a REALLY simplified conceptual case for example of a processor directly interfacing with the laser hardware. Suppose you want 1m resolution and assume each step below can be done in one clock cycle.

1. "Pulse pin connected to power transistor to turn laser on and off"
2. "Start timer"
3. "when pin connected to laser diode goes high, stop timer"

Then you'd need a 150MHz processor (not 300MHz, remember...the light travels to the target and back so you can be twice as slow but it's still really fast) if that's all it was doing. In reality, each step described would take multiple instructions to execute along with all the overhead and other things the processor is doing (especially if is running an operating system of any kind), easily pushing it up into the multi-GHz range.

Now, if you are talking about an FPGA on the other hand...then things might look a little better (they are used extensively in RADAR after all). No software to execute to eat up clock cycles. The FPGA just sits there like a non-software digital circuit doing the only job it was configured to do. THough, they aren't the most hobby-friendly devices though in terms of availability of development tools and parts, ease of PCB mounting. THings are much better now though than they used to be. They also don't "work" or "program" like processors. It requires thinking in terms of the physical parts you need to pull off an algorithm rather than the "steps" that must be done.

EIther way, it will involve some very high frequency hardware which is very sensitive to layout. You'd certainly need to get a very carefully designed one made at a board house, and requiring that it be a special impedance matched board is likely. ($$$)

 

[EternityForest]

Digi-Key - 576-2491-ND (Manufacturer - SY10E137JZ)

this is a surface mount part (which you probably want to use anyway because of the high frequencies)
it costs about five bucks and counts with 8 bits up to i think 2.2GHZ.

they have a lot more counters and this might not be the best but i think digi-key is a great place to find componets because they have so many parts.

make sure the laser you use is not going to blind people or be illegal. you also might think about multiple returns, like pointing it at a tree and getting a return for each leaf that gets illuminated. it's a pretty big project, but not impossible. Ultrasonic rangefinding is much simpler and only needs a few MHZ for high accuracy readings(plus no eye hazard). i should add that with ultrasonics you don't need any counters or high speed stuff and a few khz is enough for sub-foot accuracy. the range might not be as good though.

glad to help

 

[dknguyen]

For your interest:
**broken link removed**

Note that it's a thesis and ASICs are involved which can be out of reach for companies, let alone an individual person. An FPGA is about the cloest thing you can get to an ASIC (and are used in prototyping digital ASICs).

I should also mention that you can make an ultrasonic rangefinder much more interesting using modulation on the transmitter and signal processing on the receiver. Rather than crudely looking for a spike in receiver power, you can pick out the uniquely modulated echo out of the noise so you can be more sure that what you receive is actually the signal that you sent. Other possibilities are doppeler capabilities with fourier transforms and the like. (Many of these will require a fast processor or FPGA, but not impossibly fast like a processor directly controlling the transmit and receive of a laser rangefinder. Doing the same things with radar are firmly in the realm of defense and aerospace with their unlimited resources and expertise.

Along with it being easier to get high resoltion with sonar, it's also much easier to get a lower minimum range even though the range may be shorter than laser.

 

[insight]

Thing is that the distances I want to measure go up to about 400 meters and ultra sound can't do that.

There are tons of long range laser range finders on eBay and Amazon for about $150. From that I conclude that they are hard, but not impossible to make.

I even bought one and opened it up, just to see what components are they using. Would you like to have a look inside?

 

[dknguyen]

Thing is that the distances I want to measure go up to about 400 meters and ultra sound can't do that.

There are tons of long range laser range finders on eBay and Amazon for about $150. From that I conclude that they are hard, but not impossible to make.

I even bought one and opened it up, just to see what components are they using. Would you like to have a look inside?

Sure. I mainly look at them for UAV laser altimeters, but so far they are out of reach. I tend to need really low minimum distances with good resolution that are unaffected by wind but I don't need terribly high maximum distances (100m is more than enough).
https://www.electro-tech-online.com/custompdfs/2010/05/AeriusMiniatureLaserRangefinder.pdf
I think that one was $6000. I'm not quite sure what I'm looking at in the photo of the device actually.

Have you checked out the opti-logic OEM modules?
**broken link removed**
They run around $500-$600, but I've never used them because their minimum range is too high for my purposes. Like if one chunk is the processing board and the other is the laser/receiver module, or one chunk is the transmitter and the other is the receiver.

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

Thing is that the distances I want to measure go up to about 400 meters and ultra sound can't do that.

There are tons of long range laser range finders on eBay and Amazon for about $150. From that I conclude that they are hard, but not impossible to make.

I even bought one and opened it up, just to see what components are they using. Would you like to have a look inside?

Why not just buy one then? (or use the one you did) - you're unlikely to be in the position to develop custom made IC's, which is most likely what they use.

 

[insight]

Here are some direct links to photos of the internal electronics for this LR. Model is most likely more than 2 years old:

**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**

 

[misterT]

Thing is that the distances I want to measure go up to about 400 meters and ultra sound can't do that.
There are tons of long range laser range finders on eBay and Amazon for about $150. From that I conclude that they are hard, but not impossible to make.
I even bought one and opened it up, just to see what components are they using. Would you like to have a look inside?

Laser rangefinder is very hard to build. And the avalanche photodiode you need to detect the laser pulse costs over 100 dollars alone.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avalanche_photodiode
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Cat=1967048&k=avalanche photodiode
EG & G VACTEC|C30902EH|PHOTODIODE, AVALANCHE

What kind of sensor is in the rangefinder you opened?

 

[insight]

Thanks for the info about avalanche diodes. I would expect to spend up to $400-500. Main problem is circuit and capturing the time of flight.

I didn't open the part where sensor was, because sensor was sealed inside a small telescope with IR filter on the lens. My intention was to sell it back on eBay, which I did rescently. Obviously they used filter to remove the visible light noise. Something else was very interesting. PCB in the vicinity of sensor and laser emitter was shrouded in a brass shielding. I guess that whole lot of big current burst was thrown into a laser during the emitting phase and that shielding was required to protect the rest of electronics.

 

[Sceadwian]

The laser pulses it sends out are probably a high frequency pulsetrain, the shielding is to avoid transmitting anything from the PCB traces. What's preventing you from interfacing with the module you currently have? By the way that Altera module is an FPGA, they run up to a few GHZ. I would lean towards Xilinix because they have a very nice completely free development environment, and the development boards won't break the bank, though I'm not sure about the optics themselves. Then you have to learn to program VHDL, but FPGAs are incredibly programmable.

 

[dknguyen]

Laser rangefinder is very hard to build. And the avalanche photodiode you need to detect the laser pulse costs over 100 dollars alone.
Avalanche photodiode - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Optical - Photo Detectors - Photodiodes | Digi-Key
EG & G VACTEC|C30902EH|PHOTODIODE, AVALANCHE

What kind of sensor is in the rangefinder you opened?

Oh is it an avalanche diode they used? I knew they use that for fiber optics, but it never occured to me they might use that for LIDARs.