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Windows 10 Fear and Loathing

Discussion in 'Product & Service Reviews' started by spec, Jan 13, 2016.

  1. spec

    spec Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Why tv?
     
  2. RichTheDude

    RichTheDude Active Member

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    Carrying a driving license is not in our legal system mind, I never carry mine. If a cop wants to pull me up for something, they can go through the hassle of giving me a producer.

    The idea of carrying an ID card is abhorrent to me.
     
  3. synaptic

    synaptic New Member

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    For those that are using W10 and like it enough to stay with it , I'm adding a few notes .

    And for people who DO NOT want it , but are tired of W10 " Nagware " , pop-ups etc , then get "GWX Control Panel" from here
    http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/

    download it and run it .... it's small and light ( and free ) , and safe to use.

    Back to the technical aspects of Windows 10 , and leaving aside my own experiences with it : -

    Here is a brief summary of the key privacy issues with W10 from Emsisoft , a highly respected security firm .

    But it's not all bad news , there are a few things that can help protect people who are using W10 but are concerned ( and rightly so )
    about the compromise to their privacy , it's free from O&O software in Berlin
    https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10

    There are further details and set-up tips here at Wilders Security
    Take a look at the screenshots posted by "Banzi" ( #14 ) and you will see the real extent of what W10 is reporting about you ,
    all day , every day , and keep in mind that these are all turned ON by default !
    ..... " What can't speak can't lie ".

    And yes , I've tried it in my test machine , and it works well , up to a point , but MS are already altering detected
    user settings that they don't like or approve of , via the Updates.

    Using various network tools , I can easily "see" the traffic with MS , but it is encrypted , so the best I can do
    is identify which processes and services in W10 are reponsible for it.
    But there is certainly much more of it than I ever saw on any previous versions of Windows.

    I should make clear that W10 has not caused ME any problems whatsoever , and it never will .
    But that is because I would never have it installed ( outside of a VM ) on any of my machines , but I DO need to
    stay familiar with all current Windows versions for a good part of my work.

    There is more to read on this for those that are interested , here at Infoworld

    and " from the horse's mouth " here
    https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement/

    I hope this is of some use to ETO members.

    BTW , I have no connection with any of the software I mentioned above.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2016
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  4. dave

    Dave New Member

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  5. spec

    spec Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    It is odd how sometimes something good is interpreted as something bad. A clear case for me was when I was looking for a decent intelligent AAA, AA battery charger. A reviewer on Amazon UK had damed an otherwise excellent charger because it had an off load terminal voltage of around 24V (can't remember exact figure). He said that a voltage that high was obviously a design drop-off and would damage a 1.25V cell. It seemed that he had made a good point and I moved on but later, being curious, I read up on battery charging, and found that far from being a drop off it was a desirable feature. Apparently, if a battery has gone high resistance you need a high voltage, at a limited current, to punch through the barrier that has built up and get the chemistry working again.

    I had a similar experience while bemoaning the fact that Microsoft updates Win10 when they think fit and there is no facility, like there used to be on previous versions of Windows, for the user to either turn this off or to approve updates. But, it was explained to me by someone wiser, that MS updates Win10 automatically because they want to protect both the user and the reputation of their operating system. It was also pointed out that as I have a Lenovo laptop Win10 updates can be configured to update on approval if required by using a Lenovo routine for the machine.

    What has automatic updates to do with security? What has been happening in the past is that many computers OSs simply were not updated. I have seen this myself where you check a PC and find there are literately hundreds of Windows updates in a queue waiting to be installed. This gives hackers all they need on a plate. They simply look at the Microsoft patches to see a vulnerability on previous versions of Windows and then they have an in to all the PCs that have not been updated. That is why Microsoft decided on fast automatic Win10 updates. By the way, I have had automatic updates disabled and instead gone for ask first on my laptop.

    As an aside, apparently one of the most vulnerable applications is Adobe Reader, not because it is particularly vulnerable per sec, but because its wide usage makes it a gratifying target for hackers.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2016
  6. spec

    spec Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    If you are updating a previous version of Windows to Win10, it can take an age, typically eight hours. In fact, it takes so long that some people think the upgrade has failed and have aborted. I understand that, to speed things up, it is better to download an ISO image of Win10 update and burn it to a DVD and update your PC from the DVD rather than directly over the net.

    spec
     
  7. alec_t

    alec_t Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Fortunately my upgrade from Win8.1 to Win10 took under 2 hours on a Lenovo laptop. Not sure what factors affect the time.
     
  8. spec

    spec Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    No, I'm not sure either, but I would imagine that it depends on how many and the type of applications you have installed on your machine.
    A new install on my T520 with SSD took about 10 minutes, if I remember correctly.

    spec
     
  9. audioguru

    audioguru Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    I cannot save a Texas Instruments PDF datasheet on my pc with Win 10. To save a video I must "Open with Internet Explorer" then "save target as.." but it is a nuisance. I need to do that to save most datasheets from everywhere else.
    I do not know if the problem to download a PDF is caused by Win 10, Adobe, Texas Instruments or me. Datasheet Archive (.com) or at TI the link to download the datasheet of the OPA1622 IC is just the link to the datasheet on TI's website. I want the PDF on my hard drive, I don't want a link to it that is here today but maybe will be gone tomorrow. Can anyone here show me how to save a datasheet of the OPA1622 with my WIN 10 op system?
     
  10. Little Ghostman

    Little Ghostman Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    I had the beta version of WIN 10 before they added cortana and the spying chit, its a bit buggy but I run it in a vm. I use win 8.1 on a very good machine (I9) but would hate to run it on less than 16GB mem, win 7 is still the best they have done so far but alot of new machines dont have drivers for win7.

    I run a few OS in VM's as I like the security of being able to delete the VM if it gets infected. I also like Linux so VM's give me the best of all worlds, but I have a i9 quad core processor and 32GB ram. so VM's run nice and smooth, I normally give 2 cores to the VM and 16 GB of ram
     
  11. spec

    spec Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Hi ag,

    Can you download the TI OPA1622 data sheet from this address: http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/opa1622.pdf Just to let you know that I have just done that under Win10 using Firefox browser, so there is nothing wrong with the TI site.

    I would advise you to dump Internet Explorer - it is yesterdays news- and go to Mozilla Firefox , or Google Chrome or possibly Microsoft Edge (will be already installed).

    To install Firefox and Chrome download the latest versions of both browsers to a folder on your HDD. Uninstall any versions of Firefox if present on your machine and reboot. Uninstall any versions of Chrome existing on your machine and reboot.

    Install Firefox from your HDD. Reboot. Do the same for Chrome.

    Then try downloading the data sheet from the TI site above using Firefox. You can configure Firefox to automatically save to C:/Users> [username]> Downloads or to ask you where to save or whether to just open the document. To me the latter is the best.

    Once you have Firefox installed, a wealth of useful addons will be open to you.

    Sometimes when Firefox won't do something, Chrome will and vice versa. Chrome is generally faster and more robust but Firefox is not far behind and has the best user interface- especially for bookmarks- by a mile.

    spec
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2016
  12. audioguru

    audioguru Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    That is my problem. The link opens the PDF but when browsing with EDGE or with Internet Explorer then WIN 10 does not have "save as..." so I cannot copy the PDF or download it.
    But I doo dit!:joyful:
    I looked all over the screen for a button or something to allow me to "save as" but I found nothing. Then while looking at the PDF on the screen I accidently "right clicked on it" and on it there was the missing "save as" in the middle of the PDF.
    I just tried that to download a video but the "save as..." did not show in EDGE but it showed when I switched the browser to internet Explorer.
    Thanks for your help.:)
     
  13. throbscottle

    throbscottle Well-Known Member

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    Both Mrs throbscottle and her mum upgraded to w10, and subsequently downgraded back to w7. I'm still using Arch Linux. For work I have a tablet with w8 on it. Hate the f***ing thing.
    Interesting to know, a lot of commercial systems still run NT, DOS and XP. Oh I have also encountered a w2k machine running an access database in an insurance company I helped upgrade some kit for. W7 is still being cautiously rolled out on corporate systems to upgrade from XP, and probably still will be doing for years. The latest pos systems come with w7. A German supermarket I did some work for run SuSe Linux on their tills.
     
  14. spec

    spec Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Hi ag,

    When you click on a site with a pdf to download are you seeing something like this:

    ETO_2016_02_28_AG_DOWNLOAD.png
    If so, that is a pdf opening in your browser. In that case you download by clicking the download button above the red hand drawn arrow, top right.
    Alternatively the document may open in the application associated with pdfs, normally Adobe Reader. In that case you right click anywhere on the document and then click Save, or Save As. Alternatively click on File (top left)> Save or Save As.

    If you get any problems open File Explorer and right click on any pdf and then select Open With to set the application that Win 10 uses by default to open your pdfs, normally Adobe Reader. (you can download Adobe Reader for free)

    spec
     
  15. spec

    spec Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Why did they go back to Win 7? I see no essential difference between Win 10 and Win7 at the user level (I was a big fan of XP, and Win7- but not Win8)

    They are living dangerously. By the way, I understand that Win10 is the most secure of the Win versions so far.
     
  16. Little Ghostman

    Little Ghostman Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Secure apart from microsoft having full access, put a scanner on your ports and its shocking how many different calls it makes.

    When you need secure write it down and lock it away ;)
     
  17. spec

    spec Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Yes, but that is a personal privacy issue rather than a worry about destructive or fraudulent attacks. I don't think Microsoft have started that yet, but in terms of the latter I am not sure about Google, who to me are the most intrusive. :banghead:
     
  18. jpanhalt

    jpanhalt Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Why Win7? Privacy is important. If you allow peeping, it will happen. The information will be used by MS in any way it pleases, and in reality, there is no recourse.

    Second, you can actually own Win7. You do not have to update it ever, if you don't want to. As I understand it, Win10 is basically a lease and you must "update it" at certain intervals. An update can include anything Microsoft decides to install on your computer, and you have no say in the matter. At least, that is how I read the end user's agreement originally. Maybe that has changed, I haven't bothered to check back since.

    Third, the promise of security comes at a cost too. Moreover, does Microsoft guarantee that security or is it just a marketing ploy?

    John
     
  19. alec_t

    alec_t Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    I think the latter. Why else the continuing need for frequent updates?
    Haven't all versions of Win claimed to be the 'best/safest ever'?
    As for owning/leasing Win10, I thought with all previous versions you were paying just for a licence to use the OS. Is that ownership?
     
  20. Little Ghostman

    Little Ghostman Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Win 10 is slightly different, because people used to sometimes put linux or another windows on MS has stopped this, if you try and change the OS then you will looes all your files. They have messed people up with one drive as well, promising unlimited storage then suddenly deleting files when they decided against it in the end. I hate this cloud stuff and office 365. I am not a big fan of MS
     
  21. jpanhalt

    jpanhalt Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    You own the license, and you are correct it is a license, not the software per se that you own. You are not allowed to resale the license anymore, I don't think. Years ago, you could (see: First Sale, below).

    What I should have said to be more precise is that the license is perpetual and there is no renewal fee involved, nor can it be revoked by MS without cause and/or payment of compensation. The difference between license and ownership can lead to arcane legal argument. For example, see this discussion of the first-sale issue (http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/03/thai-student-protected-by-first-sale-supreme-court-rules/ ). The matter described in that link was just recently (2013) resolved in the United States. Wikipedia also has a discussion of the first-sale doctrine. If you really are interested in what distinguishes licenses, ownership, control, fines, and taxes in the United States, any basic law book should discuss that. I found those distinctions most interesting. In fact, that class was one of the most interesting classes I had as an undergraduate. It was one I never skipped.

    Since SCOTUS ruled that first-sale applies to books, it is no wonder that software vendors have reacted with time-limited licenses. Books, particularly textbooks may also be sold as licenses...I haven't followed those developments. Nevertheless, I like to have ownership of the license for something I use everyday and intend to keep using. I still own a very intuitive 2D CAD program "license" that is at least 10 years old and still works well today on Win7.

    John
     

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