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Jeeperz: Room exploring robot in development

Discussion in 'Robotics & Mechatronics' started by Souper man, Jul 7, 2007.

  1. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    Hmmmmm, that is not a bad idea. Is there anything special that goes into one of those? I was kinda leaning towards nigel's IR board, which looks good.

    CHECK IT OUT --------> www.winpicprog.co.uk/pic_tutorial_ir_board.htm

    Thanks!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 9, 2007
  2. blueroomelectronics

    blueroomelectronics Well-Known Member

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    Nigels IR board is not a distance ranger, it's for TV remote IR pickup.

    Souper man, it's time to learn about microcontrollers... Robotics built with discreet chips are very simple. If you want to pursue simple logic based designs then you should follow the Beam Robotics stuff.
    http://www.solarbotics.net/

    Or you could build a computer based on TTL chips but it takes a lot of parts...
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2007
  3. Marks256

    Marks256 New Member

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    If you really want to get geeky, how about sonar? :D

    http://www.seattlerobotics.org/encoder/200010/dlcsonar.html

    I did it with the basic stamp, and it worked very well. I am sure you could mod it for a PIC. My camera was like $15 all together on ebay.


    When i had the sonar going, i was thinking of putting it on top of a servo motor, so it could rotate slowly to build a simple "image" of what was ahead of it. I never got around to it, though. Maybe you could try it for detecting things farther away than the IR can see.
     
  4. dave

    Dave New Member

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  5. Souper man

    Souper man Guest


    You have backed me in the corner... my answer is...

    DAMNIT I GUESS IM LEARNING MICROCONTROLLERZ!

    But I have zero experience in programming, so I could probably get a LED to light then I would wet myself...

    Ok what am I going to need and what am I going to do?

    I was thinking of using the PIC 16f628, but My robot might need more I/O pins, and jameco (one of the few stores I can buy from) wont have the microcontroller until 7/20. What other chips can I use that are very easy to pick up and use, and are supported by bills programmer?
    What is a good programming language?

    I will try and buy bills programmer.

    I need some major help getting started, so please check back with this thread every few mins, because I am ordering 200+ stuff today.

    I also have a futaba s3004 servo, if that means anything.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 9, 2007
  6. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    Also, What kind of infrared or sonar, or whatever should I get?
     
  7. blueroomelectronics

    blueroomelectronics Well-Known Member

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    All you need is a 16F877A it's common, old and very well supported by pretty much every programmer out there. Lots of I/O pins (33), multichannel A/D converter built in and much more.

    To start build a simple LVP programmer like the one on Lothar Stolz site.
    [​IMG]
    And IC-Prog (the software)
    http://www.ic-prog.com/

    Remember is LVP mode you have to keep RB3 grounded (you lose the I/O)

    You can even start with the demo version of PIC BASIC Pro (40 lines of code)
    http://www.melabs.com/
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2007
  8. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    this plugs right into a 9pin computer socket? wow thats convient!

    Yay I also get a big chip (I <3 big chips, makes it look complicated)

    So i lose only one I/O pin? thats ok. dont I also need a 20mhz crystal and stuff? wouldnt I just just nigels 16f877a PIC board?
     
  9. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    To drive the motors, I would need a h bridge, but what about this one?

    http://www.robotroom.com/HBridge.html

    I know that Driving a motor directly from a microcontroller could damage the microcontroller when i disable the motor, so this would protect it right?

    Also, where would I plug the 9 pin header into? where the monitor is?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 9, 2007
  10. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    Im about to press the order button on my shipment, so now is the time for any last minute parts i will need.

    Also, how do i download the program software?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 9, 2007
  11. bloody-orc

    bloody-orc New Member

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    NO! DON't go there! ;) Let's start a PIC vs AVR flame war!
    go with AVRs! they are more fun. Programmer is just 2 resistors in LPT port. (or was that three). Hi-Tech debugging and programming equipment is just 49$ on Digikey (Dragon and STK500 combo). Microchirps ICD costs a lot more and offers MUCH less.

    To get started, get yourself an ATMEGA48 or 88 and hook it up to your programmer. And a way you go. shove in some code in C (PLEASE do NOT go with asm nor basic). blink some LEDs, control some motors (using H-bridge of course) etc. pure fun.

    AVRfreaks.org , Atmel.com
     
  12. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    BLOODY ORC!!! BUWHAHAHAHAHAAH! IT IS TOO LATE!

    I went with PICs, because they are better! AVR's are for retarded little children who dont have a dad, and have to eat turkey and chicken hotdogs!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 9, 2007
  13. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    Could I use ultrasonic sensors for room seeking?

    go here for the thing I am talking about

    ------------>http://www.elexp.com/kit_0a5r.htm<-------------
     
  14. bloody-orc

    bloody-orc New Member

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    Sonar is only useful, when you want to see a lot at the time. no good for detecting the shape and placement of the object. (like something is 5 degrees to the left or something like that). ultrasonic sensor has a VERY wide viewing angle.

    And AVR's are better as they are faster and more powerful. even microchip agrees with that.
     
  15. Nigel Goodwin

    Nigel Goodwin Super Moderator Most Helpful Member

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    I seriously doubt MicroChip would agree with that! :p

    They 'might' agree that AVR's out perform low end PIC's, but high end PIC's are at least as fast and powerful as AVR's, if not more so?.

    Perhaps you might also consider the sales figures?, both companies publish their figures (as required by law) - PIC sales absolutely wipe the floor with AVR sales :D

    But in any case, we're in the Robotics forum, where micro-controllers runing off clockwork would be more than fast enough!.
     
  16. HarveyH42

    HarveyH42 Banned

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    Wow, and this comes from somebody who has yet to program their first chip... I can tell there will be millions of questions ask before that happens.

    I think the main difference in PIC and AVR sales and popularity is marketing and target markets. Microchip donates alot of materials to educational facilities, give away samples like Halloween candy. Atmel went after the industrial/manufacturing market. Not sure about the sample policy, I buy my parts as needed. I went with AVR after considerable research, it was my best fit. You should do the same, look at what's availiable, and what is best suited to you. PIC probably is the best choice, since you have the basic ideas, but depend on other people's work to pull it all together. Plenty of PIC stuff on the web.

    Most hobby projects don't come close to pushing the limits of what these chips can do, so arguing about who makes the fastest or most powerful is really sort of 'retarded', as you would put it.

    Now, do you know a programming language? Or will you need to learn C or BASIC first?
     
  17. Nigel Goodwin

    Nigel Goodwin Super Moderator Most Helpful Member

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    Interesting point, as that's the market where MicroChip reign supreme - Atmel are chasing that market because it's where the sales are!.
     
  18. HarveyH42

    HarveyH42 Banned

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    Mostly opinion based on what I find while searching for information for projects. I'm not a stock holder, or really interested in the business/sales aspect, so could be wrong altogether.
    I haven't even a year experience with microcontrollers, so still very much a beginner, and couldn't possiably argue any of the finer points. I agree that PIC is most likely his best choice, although not so much the method. Went from logic chips and opamps in less then a day... Well Nigel, guess you're going to be busy with this one for a while, good luck.
     
  19. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    I am probably going to try and learn BASIC first, since I believe that is the easier to learn. I air mailed my stuff (arrives within 4 days) so I could start quickly. I will take any and all help (I am using a PIC 16F877A) with my Microcontroller stuff. I think I have to build Nigels 16F877A board. (the Crystal part is what I think I am talking about).

    Note to harvey: I have been trying to study Microcontrollers for a couple months. There is awlays a good time to start learning microcontrollers, so I did it now. Whats wrong with learning?:p :p :p :p
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 9, 2007
  20. Souper man

    Souper man Guest

    Also, on nigels 877A board, I dont have any 12pf caps, all i have are some 10pf. Will these work?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 9, 2007
  21. Nigel Goodwin

    Nigel Goodwin Super Moderator Most Helpful Member

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    10pF is fine, I use anything between 10pF and 33pF, never had a problem.
     

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