Antenna Tower Advice

[jpanhalt]

I have spent the past three weeks trying to get wireless Internet at the "farm." The location is surrounded by trees. With all the restocking fees to Verizon and third party vendors, it has not been cheap. Verizon has one more chance with its HomeFusion device. If that fails, I will be committed to putting up a tower. Here is a link to a related thread on getting Internet at that location: https://www.electro-tech-online.com/threads/verizon-eek.131593/

The tower will need to be 50' high. I strongly prefer a free-standing tower. It will only have an Internet-capable omni antenna on it, e.g., an antenna for 4G LTE or similar.

Does anyone have experience with or opinions about steel towers (e.g, Rohn or American Tower) versus aluminum (e.g, Palco, http://www.palcoelectronics.com/p1006598.aspx )?

John

 

[Ian Rogers]

Hey John!! I suppose fibre optic's out then.... ( I'm sorry to take the urine )

There was a guy in the outback... In Australia somewhere... He connected some sort of fast connection using radio phones... If I remember the story correctly. He was struggling with internet connections.... I believe it was paired.. Similar to ISDN. I know its only 128k per connection, but it worked.

 

[ronsimpson]

John, Can you see a neighbor's house that has internet? For years I have been getting internet from town, 5miles away. In several cases I have helped some one get internet from a neighbors house. A 2.4ghz link with a home made directional antenna will certainly jump 1 mile and often 5 miles on a clear day. Now I use 5ghz and works better.

You asked about 50 foot tower. I think it needs a bunch of concrete. I have used wires and little concrete.

 

[jpanhalt]

I cannot see a neighbor's house. Here is a relatively close Google earth view:

View attachment 69063

I marked 3 possible tower locations. The one by the barn or behind the house (probably mover further East -- to the right) would be most desirable aesthetically. The home is surrounded by a large county park. Elevation wise, it is a relatively straight shot to the nearest tower. The problem is trees.

Digging a hole for concrete is no problem. Six feet by 2' X 2' is called for. Even if it were 3X3, that is only 2 yards.

Aluminum is attractive because there is no need to paint it, and it is light weight. It is also a hinged tower. But, I am worried about strength and load ratings. It is rated for a 200# person to climb. I am only 185#, but if one were carrying tools and fully clothed, it would not be to hard to get to that limit.

I have never had a tower.

John

 

[Ian Rogers]

I was looking into satelite.... You can install a satelite internet for £18.. https://www.toowaydirect.com/landin...st-internet/?gclid=CImt2aKugLQCFWbKtAodExAAZw

I think There is one in the USA that starts at $49...

 

[jpanhalt]

Location Tower2 had a satellite dish by the original builder, circa 1995. It was quite large and a bit intimidating as it greeted you coming up the drive. More modern dishes are quite small, and there are a couple of providers in the area. The usual complaint is latency, speeds, and data limits. Among my neighbors, satellite is used for entertainment, but is not that popular for Internet.

The two plans I am considering are 10 GB/month (Verizon HomeFusion) at $60 USD, if it works. The solution that requires the tower is from a local wireless provider that provides unlimited data at 3Mbps upload/768 Kbp download at about the same monthly cost. On a site visit, he was able to get about 1Mbps down, but he was unable to test his newest equipment. Tower cost is estimated at between $1500 to $2000, including concrete and using new components. Verizon says the site qualifies for HomeFusion without a tower, but I have reservations. Thus, I am preparing for the need to erect a tower. With a tower, my options will expand to 4 wireless companies (Sprint, ATT, Verizon, local), but of course, there is the cost, ugliness, and maintenance of the tower to consider.

John

 

[alec_t]

It is also a hinged tower. But, I am worried about strength and load ratings.

Then do you need to climb it? A hinged tower can be lowered to a horizontal position for maintenance.

 

[RadioRon]

You can't go too far wrong with a name brand steel tower, but the aluminum is indeed tempting. I start my tower shopping at TexasTowers.com and branch out from there. I was wondering, though, why in the world would you put an omni on a tower when you are fighting for link budget. Why not a directional antenna?

 

[jpanhalt]

I am right in the middle of several cell towers. They are all about 5 to 6 miles away. My problem is primarily trees. A Verizon installer suggested an omni, as it can switch to an alternative tower, if one goes down or the traffic is very heavy.

I tested a directional panel antenna (Wilson) at 30' AGL and got about -110 to -105 dB for Verizon with a Jetpack. With a bucket lift, we measured signals from a different source with a Yagi and got much better signal at 50' compared to 25' to 30'.


John

 

[RadioRon]

OK, I see the point of the omni. Not knowing your path in detail I'm just commenting in general, but at 5 to 6 miles your shot is not a short one. If the omni works, thats fine, but your alternative might be to use a directional antenna on a rotater. You could pick up another 10 dB that way, which might be valuable. Another setup that may be useful, although not really compatible with a rotater, is to set up for space diversity, using two antennas at different heights on your tower. May not be needed if you have clear line of sight, and if you can tune your antenna height for best signal during the installation. Some radios support this via two coax connectors and internal switching. In any event, you are going the right way in focusing on height.

 

[jpanhalt]

Hi Ron,

Thanks for the tips. I have never messed with a ground-based antenna. My real question is steel versus aluminum for the tower. I also notice that the hinged steel towers require a building for support about 20' up, but the aluminum ones do not.

I work mostly by myself at the farm, but can get day laborers from the nearby Amish community. The aluminum, hinged tower has a lot of attractive elements, and I am pretty sure I could erect it myself with the help of my excavator. The added weight of the steel tower would make me more willing to climb it, rather than lay it down. I simply don't understand why it requires a building for support.

John

 

[MikeMl]

I have a TX455 tower up for ham use. It is a 55' crank up (23' when cranked down). It weighs 660#. It is standing in 11cu yds (a full truck) of concrete. I have it bracketed to my hangar at about 20' up. If it were free-standing (unguyed) out away from the building, it is supposed to be in 14cu. yds of concrete, but that allows for ~18sq. ft of antenna wind loading. The data sheet for that tower is**broken link removed**.

 

[jpanhalt]

Wow, thanks. I thought briefly about a crank up antenna. How often do you have to service the top?

Something tied to the barn (only 16' eaves)is not out of the question (shown as "Tower" in the Google view), but I would prefer not to. I am kind of paranoid about raccoons and ground hogs. I helped 22 raccoons and 15 ground hogs find their maker this year. I don't want to give them a welcome mat to my roof. Next year, I am shooting for a raccoon coat.

John

 

[RadioRon]

I would add that if a reputable tower builder is saying his tower is rated for, say, 200# and you are less than 200# I think you should be fine. Ratings like that should have margin to them for live load variation (like a 200 lb monkey swinging around the top of the tower?). Ultimately, i would want to talk directly to the tower maker to understand his rating and his concern for life and limb.