Am I doing something wrong?

[gramo]

It compiles too 18 Assembler Program Words

Why did you stop recommending MikroBASIC?

mikroBasic is by far too buggy and unstable from what I found. The mikroElectronica development team is more focused on catering for the entire market(PIC's, AVR, dsPIC, 24F PICs) rather than making an extremely clean and highly reliable development suit that is device specific.

A quick comparison between Swordfish and mikroBasic is evident truth of this

 

[Bryan76]

Damn! Now im getting lost on what to use or do lol I thank you all for your suggestions though.

 

[gramo]

Also Proton Lite only supports 4 PICs.

That’s explained in the little blurb I gave it. 2 of the 4 are the 16F628A and 16F877. Can’t get much more popular than that

 

[blueroomelectronics]

Follow Nigels tutorials, I've yet to post mine on my site but they are for the 16F88 as I didn't feel like writing code for all the PIC variations. Plus the 16F88 has debug support which makes coding pretty easy as you can view what's going on inside the chip (more accurate than any simulator) I use MPLAB as my tool of choice as you can assemble / compile, program & debug from within this one free and the PIC factorys (Microchip) own tool. Some basics are supported from within MPLAB such as PICBASIC Pro (even the demo version) You can step through your program line by line and view variables with the Simulator (built in) or an ICD2 (shameless plug for my design)

PS next time wire switches to PORTB and GND (you can enable weak pullups in software)

 

[gramo]

If you want the ultimate tool for debugging, Proteus's ISIS is simply superb.

I've made a quick video tutorial on how to create you first program with Proton PDS, and simulate it with ISIS
**broken link removed**

Here's a video tutorial of programming a PIC with IC-Prog
**broken link removed**

For other video tutorials that I've made, have a look here
**broken link removed**

Maybe they'll help?

 

[blueroomelectronics]

It's still only a simulator, nice tool but try to build an RFID tag reader with it. A true ICE is awesome but expensive, a simulator can make mistakes but is handy for sure. A debugger is a nice compromise as it lets you work with real hardware.

PS I looked at Protons Devopment board manual, cheeky bunch remove the schematics.
Must be some top secret designs in that board.
Plus it uses a bootloader, those can be fun and easy to crash if you're not careful.
On the plus side it does have an ICD connector on it, and the 16F877 supports debug.

Add to that Proton+ Lite only supports 35 lines of code according to the development board manual.

 

[gramo]

The bootloader is integrated too Proton, and by hitting F10, Proton will compile the program and bootload the PIC on the development board.

The development board is really not a necessity, but a nice to have.

There is even an In Circuit Debugger(ICD) specifically for Proton code, and allows for simple 'on the fly' debugging.

**broken link removed**

Key features

• Simple procedure to start debugging
• Isolate small sections only for debugging
• Set break points
• Run
• Run to cursor
• Single step through your code line by line
• View your variables changing as you step
• Collect commonly viewed variables in the Watch window
• Change variables and Eeprom data from the PC
• Add Variables to a run time watch window for real time monitoring

 

[gramo]

It's still only a simulator, nice tool but try to build an RFID tag reader with it..

Proteus has thousands of analogue and digital devices to interface with. And when you come across something that is not yet supported, simply use the advanced signal generator or a micro controller as a signal generator.

Proteus saves so much time it’s not funny. It’s anything but just a simulator.

 

[blueroomelectronics]

And it's yet another limited demo. Plus
"The amount of words added to your code will be 3-4 per line of basic for the PIC™ 16 series and 1 for the PIC™ 18 series. Obviously, as your program size increases, so does the size of the code inserted during a P-ICD compile ."

You can do all of that with much less overhead with a MPLAB ICD2. Heck my Inchworm ICD2 sells for less than they want for their software debugger and the Inchworm supports more chips, will always be up to date as MPLAB download new firmware before the chips are generally available. And it's a programmer to boot!

If you want a serious tool then C18 for the 18 series PIC has a free demo version for students that has few restrictions.

 

[blueroomelectronics]

On a sidenote, what does Proton cost? (and is that an evil USB hardware dongle in the photo?)
Proton Development Suite 150GBP or $300US
The software {cough} P-ICD 29GBP or $60US
An EPIC (they still make those?) programmer 49GPB or $100US (robbers)
Proton Development board with LCD 74GPB or $150US
Total in US dollars $610

Now lets compare to another solution
PICBASIC Pro (integrates with MPLAB) $250US
Inchworm+ ICD2 compatable programmer / debugger $45US
MPLAB free, assembler free, C18 student edition free.
Proton Development board with LCD $150US supports the ICD2 so why not
Total in US dollars $445

**broken link removed**

 

[gramo]

I wouldn’t even begin to compare PBP and Proton

Proton leaves PBP for dust, consider this posted by Tim on the Proton Forums;

You would be making a wise decision going for P+ rather than Pbpro, even current Pbpro users acknowlage that. Just look at the GLCD, data handling and Variable support to compare.

I'm not sure what you mean about Upgrades, Crownhill is constantly improving the functionality of Proton unlike Melabs, so you can say they upgrade there software constantly.

Crownhill also have a free Update policy, bug fixes general improvments are posted for free. However I would not use the word Upgrade as that generaly indicates a very large step in it's development and the last one was not free, they like every other software producer in this world has to cover development costs. You never see microsoft offering Word updates for free.

Saying all that though I am sure that the current purchase price includes any near future Upgrades, so I can comfortably say you can purchase now with no worries.

Proton has built in a 98% of Pbpro comand compatability, and those commands not covered 100% only require a little thought to swap the syntax around to make them work.

Proton can be as easy or as complex as you want it. Dispite being very simular in it's syntax with Pbpro I would say it's a lot easier.

Simple example

To Clear the screen and print on line 2 "hello"

Pbro
LCDOut $FE,$86,$FE,$0C,"Hello"

Proton+
Cls
Print at 2,1,"Hello"

A = 100*656 is not possible in Pbpro as the answer will be to big for it to handle.

Proton can easly handle say
A = 100 * 2684354

Just a quick note on your figures/facts;

The debug feature you were referring too was for Proton Basic Code, you can debug the .asm files the compiler produces with any generic ICD.

The EPIC programmer is not required, sure its an old product, but evidently its still popular. This would bring the cost down to $510 (If you wanted to buy a complete package - doubt many would)

Remember that Proton Ships as a Development suit with 6 pre-made digital SIM boards ready for use within ISIS. There is more functionality there then you could poke a stick at.

The 'Evil' usb key is to stop piracy, and my bet is that its doing a superb job. Good on em.

 

[blueroomelectronics]

And MPLAB with assembler is free, you only need a simple programmer like a JDM or better yet an ICD2 like mine.
Problem with BASIC is it's different from one compiler to the next.

What is a digital SIM board?

 

[Bryan76]

My god!!!

All i want is to experiment with my JDM Programmer (Ludipipo)!!!! lol I had no idea this stuff got so deep. I have 2 pic16f84a's and 3 pic16f628's (took your advice) on the way. My main goal is to find a way to interface with my computer through USB so I can make a simple joystick (i want to make one not buy one). I also just want to build on my knowledge of pics and have fun. I didnt realize there are so many diffrent options

 

[blueroomelectronics]

My god!!!

All i want is to experiment with my JDM Programmer (Ludipipo)!!!! lol I had no idea this stuff got so deep. I have 2 pic16f84a's and 3 pic16f628's (took your advice) on the way. My main goal is to find a way to interface with my computer through USB so I can make a simple joystick (i want to make one not buy one). I also just want to build on my knowledge of pics and have fun. I didnt realize there are so many diffrent options

LOL we're having fun. Your JDM is fine, now as for USB that's a different issue and you'll need C18 for that (Microchip includes C18 examples for their PICs with USB in them ie 18F4550 is popular)

Much eaiser would be a USB to RS232 adapter and use the 16F628 USART, now you really should have PICed a PIC with A/D for your joystick.

PS most high level languages have bugs, hence the amount of revisions.
https://www.melabs.com/support/upgrade.htm

Not sure if BASIC supports USB? Gramo?

 

[Bryan76]

LOL we're having fun. Your JDM is fine, now as for USB that's a different issue and you'll need C18 for that (Microchip includes C18 examples for their PICs with USB in them ie 18F4550 is popular)

Much eaiser would be a USB to RS232 adapter and use the 16F628 USART, now you really should have PICed a PIC with A/D for your joystick.

PS most high level languages have bugs, hence the amount of revisions.
https://www.melabs.com/support/upgrade.htm

Not sure if BASIC supports USB? Gramo?

The rs232 to usb sounds good. Would there be any reason not to go that way? Also what (A/D for your joystick) is A/D?

 

[gramo]

Yeah, this thread really went left wing

I exported a couple of piccys of the pre-made circuits.

You can load your program onto the PIC and simulate in near real time with unbelievable precision. The amount of time I spend developing with a VSM is now around 90% compared to real life simulating. It takes wiring out of the question, and allows instantaneous additions/edits to either the program or the circuit with simple clicks from the mouse.

The debugging/circuit design features are second to none. Whether it be real time PIC(any device) hardware information, or UART/SPI/I2C/1-Wire serial debugging tools, oscilloscopes, voltmeters, ammeters, signal generators(very large range), thousands of analogue/digital devices, it really is second to none.

Using a VSM will cut your debugging time by unbelievable amounts

 

[gramo]

PS most high level languages have bugs, hence the amount of revisions.

Those are but the old days, most compilers are extremely stable, and many updates are for new commands/feature support of new PIC's

From my experience, a higher language compiler would provide a much more (if any) 'bug free' environment compared to a rather large assembler program.

Not sure if BASIC supports USB? Gramo?

A USB example from the Proton PDS help File

 REPEAT                                       ' Wait for USB input
 USBIN 3, IN_BUFFER, AUTO                     ' Poll the USB and Receive some data from endpoint 3
 UNTIL STATUS.0 = 0                           ' Keep looking until data is able to be received

 REPEAT : UNTIL TRNIF = 1                     ' Wait for completion

And the circuit diagram also found in the help file;

 

[blueroomelectronics]

The rs232 to usb sounds good. Would there be any reason not to go that way? Also what (A/D for your joystick) is A/D?

Analog to digital, if your joystick uses pots (variable resistors) it's pretty easy to read the value and output it to the serial port.

 

[blueroomelectronics]

Since Proton supports USB you might be able to read two pots and send it along the USB bus in less than 35 or 50 lines of code. Try to run Proton and select PIC18F2550 (has USB and A/D ports)

 

[Bryan76]

No pots just switches. I run alot of sims mostly cars. I want to create a ignition setup along with some other toggle switches such as lights and starter switch. If you look at the pic, I am going for something like that.