1. For anyone with chemistry knowledge, in terms of volume, how many liters (or whichever unit of measurement you prefer) of HHO gas will be produced from one liter of gas at SATP?
HHO is a popular term used to describe the product of the electrolysis of water, and is not really considered a "scientific" term. My intention is to use the expansion of splitting H2O into H2 and O2 to push either side of a piston, then to ignite those gasses to provide the necessary force to displace the water contained in an enclosed receptacle, where the newly formed H2O molecules will replace the ones that were just displaced. I felt like designing something and this idea came up, then did some research and found out that this is analogous to a Stirling Engine, which pleases me in a way that I can compare it to something that actually works. Instead of used a heat source to create work in an enclosed system, I am instead using a battery to create work in an enclosed system. I have no idea whether this will actually work, but it is in my desire to try, because I'd rather see it with my eyes than to see it in text, and if you say I'm wasting my time then I will kindly disregard. Please inform me if my questions have no definite answers, because what I am doing is in no way scientific at this moment, and thank you all for your insight.I do wonder what the sentence quoted above means. If there is a typo, please correct it. Otherwise, explain what is HHO? Is it a triatomic molecule like water? How does it differ from water vapor? Most important, what "gas" do you intend to make it with?
John
I am currently looking for as much information as possible, even searching through Google patents, and thanks for your insight as well.All of your questions are easily answered, at least in part, from a scientific standpoint. But, since you are into metascience, those answers won't apply.
John
What do you mean?from one liter of gas at SATP
You're right, and I decided to do some research on ideal gas. As a clarification, the water will be split as a liquid, instead of vapor, since vapor cannot idealy be mixed with electrolytes. That said, I doubt there will be a definite answer so I will have to rely on my own observations to determine the best possible solution.Read about the ideal gas law.
In brief, a mole of gas at standard conditions occupies 22.4L. Thus, two moles of water vapor (44.8L; 1 mole = 18g) split into two moles of hydrogen and one mole of oxygen will occupy 67.2 L (i.e., 3x22.4). At constant temperature, you can work out the pressures from:
[latex] P_{1}V_{1} = P_{2}V_{2}[/latex]
Note, many gases vary from the ideal gas law significantly.
John
Maybe I should consider that the water would function better in its gaseous state since there will be less friction altogether throughout the system, and it would eliminate the need for a condenser after the combustion stage, ultimately making the engine more efficient, not to mention many other benefits. As for the electrical input, I'm still working on it. I'm planning on using a pair of ignition coils connected to the four electrodes, where they will be supplied by a couple of car batteries.I agree that you should focus on electrolysis in the liquid phase, but you are incorrect in assuming that it cannot be done in a gas (https://books.google.com/books?id=Q4RvmAri4jcC&pg=PA1365&lpg=PA1365&dq=vapor+phase+electrolysis+of+water&source=bl&ots=19VCn8e51R&sig=GoaHcqT9UZLmpO3ABzs6nYOdm2w&hl=en&sa=X&ei=W-aEVbmyKIqZNqPgvTg&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=vapor phase electrolysis of water&f=false). Search on vapor phase electrolysis of water.
Finally, how do you plan to generate 40,000 V at sufficient current to produce the amount of hydrogen and oxygen that you need?
John
Which might those be? I'm confusedYou still haven addressed any of the questions alec_t or I have asked.
1. For anyone with chemistry knowledge, in terms of volume, how many liters (or whichever unit of measurement you prefer) of HHO gas will be produced from one liter of gas at SATP?
I have already explained what HHO is in an earlier post.Both alec_t and I questioned what that sentence meant, particularly the underlined portion. What gas? If you mean water vapor, remember that at ambient temperature (e.g., 25°C), its vapor pressure is only about 20 torr (roughly 3kPa).
John
Briefly, my focus is to develop an apparatus that suffices the required current to lyse at a reasonable speed, in order to work at an rpm that will be useful. That is the very reason why I originally started this thread, since I have little experience in this area. My original plan was to use ignition coils, but at this point I'm not sure what I should do.Unfortunately, I believe HHO is a stoichiometric mixture of hydrogen and oxygen. Why this discussion is allowed here, I don't know. Apparently, the current TOS do not restrict it. My next question to the TS was going to be: Please state in a single sentence what you plan to do. That is, if you succeed, what will the title or subtitle of your article in Science be?
I don't have any problem with helping a young person experiment with electrolysis or with Sterling engines. But, I think we need a realistic focus, or I see this thread wandering way off track
John
Working at a "useful" rpm is not an answer. What we are talking about here is energy and work. Stirling engines work, but produce almost no usable power. There is an entire forum devoted to them. The last time I checked, a 5 HP Stirling engine was the size of a small house. There were lots of dreamers, but no doers.in order to work at an rpm that will be useful.
So, in quantitative terms, what sort of power in watts do you intend to produce and what sort of power do you intend to use to produce those watts?
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