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Either a good idea, or I don't know what I'm talking about.

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Electric Rain

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Like you can tell from my subject, I don't know if this is either a good idea, or if I don't know what I'm talking about. :oops: :lol: It's an idea for "endless" power. Say I have two motors, both linked together by their terminals and with a belt on their shafts. Could I jump start one of them, which would turn the other one, making it generate power through it's terminals, going to the other motor to make it keep spinning after the jump start and therefore just keeping them both spinning with no power, then take power from them to power something else? I can explain further if anyone doesn't get it, I'll even make a diagram. But if you do get it, could someone tell me what I didn't think through? It seems like it would work, but SOMEthing must be wrong. :cry: And um... go easy on me if that was just a complete waste of space in these forums please... :oops: So would it work even if it were a very small amount of power I could draw? Thanks a lot.

Rain
 

Nigel Goodwin

Super Moderator
Most Helpful Member
Re: Either a good idea, or I don't know what I'm talking abo

Electric Rain said:
Like you can tell from my subject, I don't know if this is either a good idea, or if I don't know what I'm talking about. :oops: :lol: It's an idea for "endless" power. Say I have two motors, both linked together by their terminals and with a belt on their shafts. Could I jump start one of them, which would turn the other one, making it generate power through it's terminals, going to the other motor to make it keep spinning after the jump start and therefore just keeping them both spinning with no power, then take power from them to power something else? I can explain further if anyone doesn't get it, I'll even make a diagram. But if you do get it, could someone tell me what I didn't think through? It seems like it would work, but SOMEthing must be wrong. :cry: And um... go easy on me if that was just a complete waste of space in these forums please... :oops: So would it work even if it were a very small amount of power I could draw? Thanks a lot.

Rain
Sorry, but it's a stupid idea :lol:

It's called 'perpetual motion', and is impossible.

In your particular case (which has been suggested ever since electric motors were invented), there are a number of flaws - basically due to efficiency and losses. A motor puts out less mechanical power than it takes in electrical power, and a generator puts out less electrical power than the mechanical power it uses.

For your scheme to work, it would require 100% efficiency from both motor and generator - which is impossible!. In order to actually take power from the scheme it would require efficiency higher than 100%.

There have been many 'pertetual motion' machines designed over the years, all have the same basic need for greater than 100% efficiency.
 

samcheetah

New Member
your idea is simillar to the perpetual motion machine. start the thing and it will work forever.

remember one thing that the total energy of a system remains constant. so u cant generate energy from nowhere. and power is the rate of expending energy. i hope u r understanding what i am saying (u would if u have studied physics).

lets assume it works out for a short time. the motors are running. then u operate something from the motors. that something is the load of the motors. it will take energy from the motors and eventually the motors will be exhausted of all the energy they had. to continuously operate that load the motors need a continuous supply of energy which it doesnt have.

and think of all the mechanical losses. friction :?: :?:

i hope i went easy on u
 

Electric Rain

New Member
:oops: :oops: :oops: Alright then. I'm just starting out, so I don't know any of this. But thanks for telling me all of that guys, it's all good stuff to know. :| Anyway, if you will since I now know it wouldn't work, forget I asked. :lol: Thanks.

Rain
 

Eclipsed

New Member
Perpetual motion machines are theoretically impossible and would violate the second law of thermodynamics.But an interesting topic none the less, check out maxwells demon.
 

stevez

Active Member
The question is good in that the discussion helps to convey an understanding of "what goes in must come out" and the numerous variations of that statement. Now and then we'll see where someone wants to do something - and hasn't thought that part thru. A popular one seems to be the budding audiophile who wants to design a 4 kw amplifier to run from his car cigarette lighter. The first thought on an experienced person's mind is "where's he goning to get the power..." No need to apologize. We all started at the beginning too.
 

Gandledorf

New Member
There is actually one design for a perpetual motion machine that works, and provides constant output energy for a fixed setup cost. It's rather complex, and I'm not sure of the symbols for the parts, so let me explain it and hopefully I will get across what I mean. Take some Triticum aestivum that has been heat set into a rectangular section, approximately 1/2" high, 4" long, and 3" wide. Coat one side with pasturized bovine colloidal gel. Strap this onto the dorsal side of a Felis domesticus, and drop from approximately waist height.

The device will begin rotating as counter acting laws fight for dominance. It will make a lot of noise, and be pretty messy, but should rotate just above the ground indefinitely.

Enjoy!
 

Roff

Well-Known Member
Gandledorf said:
ChrisP said:
[groan] I can't believe somebody actually posted the old buttered-toast/housecat line here... :)
I don't see the words butter, toast, or house cat anywhere in my post! :wink:
True, but you've probably launched several of our fellow trolls in pursuit of Branta canadensis. :)
 

Nigel Goodwin

Super Moderator
Most Helpful Member
Gandledorf said:
The device will begin rotating as counter acting laws fight for dominance. It will make a lot of noise, and be pretty messy, but should rotate just above the ground indefinitely.
May be so, but it's not pertetual motion, it takes it's input power from gravity and small furry rodents :p
 

Gandledorf

New Member
Ron H said:
Gandledorf said:
ChrisP said:
[groan] I can't believe somebody actually posted the old buttered-toast/housecat line here... :)
I don't see the words butter, toast, or house cat anywhere in my post! :wink:
True, but you've probably launched several of our fellow trolls in pursuit of Branta canadensis. :)
And here I was hoping for a good hunt for some Gallinago gallinago.
 

Gandledorf

New Member
Nigel Goodwin said:
Gandledorf said:
The device will begin rotating as counter acting laws fight for dominance. It will make a lot of noise, and be pretty messy, but should rotate just above the ground indefinitely.
May be so, but it's not pertetual motion, it takes it's input power from gravity and small furry rodents :p
I guess the true question is whether the device rotates fast enough to pay off the energy cost of the rats, and whether said device will continue to operate when the mammalian component dies.
 

Gandledorf

New Member
Ron H said:
Has the cat morphed into a rat, or did miss something?
No Nigel just mentioned that technically the device required the energy supplied by gravity and small furry rodents.

BTW, we are all dorks. This is concrete proof.
 

Gandledorf

New Member
Nigel Goodwin said:
Ron H said:
Has the cat morphed into a rat, or did I miss something?
Please pay more attention! :lol:
Yes, please do, if we are to design a prototype in enough time so as to qualify for a Nobel Prize we really ought to stay focused!
 

Roff

Well-Known Member
Does a rat also always land on his feet? A problem I foresee is that the rat may become distracted by the toast, while a cat generally does not give a s__t about much of anything, and so may stay more focused on the job at hand.
 
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