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Different job Another Chip to identify please

Dr Bob

Member
As if I haven't enough problems the power went off while my Synology NAS was updating, It's a DS418, I have downloaded a .PAT and uncompressed it to get the BIOS out but I cannot Identify the BIOS chip, I have identified every chip on the board so I can only assume it must be the one I will upload pictures of, This chip is near the battery and the Battery and this chip are near the six pin programming port shown on the edge of the board.
The only numbers on the chip are U120 and 2227, it's a 32 pin square package.
Please can anyone help?
 

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rjenkinsgb

Well-Known Member
Most Helpful Member
That looks more like a power controller IC, with all the inductors around it?

With a lot of newer small systems, the BIOS is part of the bootloader or run by that & located within the CPU FLASH.

Or it could be such as an 8 pin EEPROM or FLASH memory, loaded to RAM as part of the boot procedure.

What's the main CPU? That header looks rather like an Atmel device programming connector, though of course many other designs may use a similar connector type.
 

Dr Bob

Member
That looks more like a power controller IC, with all the inductors around it?

With a lot of newer small systems, the BIOS is part of the bootloader or run by that & located within the CPU FLASH.

Or it could be such as an 8 pin EEPROM or FLASH memory, loaded to RAM as part of the boot procedure.

What's the main CPU? That header looks rather like an Atmel device programming connector, though of course many other designs may use a similar connector type.
Realtek RTD1296 quad core with 2gig ddr4. I thought that looking at the coils but it says on the net that thr Altera 5M80Z does the voltages, that and a few buck converters around the board

Oh! I forgot to say, there is a25L6433F 64k Flash chip next to the processor, but it's the other side of the pcb to the battery and the programming socket so I thought it would be unlikely to be the bios?
 
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rjenkinsgb

Well-Known Member
Most Helpful Member
An embedded all-flash device device would generally not have a "bios"; that's to provide a standard interface and first-stage bootloader to pull an / any operating system from external storage such as a hard drive.

An embedded system such as this would usually have a bootloader and the main system, both in FLASH storage.

The 25L6433F has protected areas which probably mean it has the bootloader in there and the rest of the system (that can be replaced by updates) in unprotected areas.

This appears to give a recovery method for a failed update? The "Mode 2" option.
 

Dr Bob

Member
An embedded all-flash device device would generally not have a "bios"; that's to provide a standard interface and first-stage bootloader to pull an / any operating system from external storage such as a hard drive.

An embedded system such as this would usually have a bootloader and the main system, both in FLASH storage.

The 25L6433F has protected areas which probably mean it has the bootloader in there and the rest of the system (that can be replaced by updates) in unprotected areas.

This appears to give a recovery method for a failed update? The "Mode 2" option.
I can't get mine to boot so I can't enter anything, all I have is the blue flashing LED of death, I will hook up a serial link tomorrow to a terminal to see if any of the boot process is running and if it is at what point it hangs, if I can get to the Marvell Prompt I should be able to load everything from USB.
If that is the case I guess the plug on the edge of the board is connecting to the Processor so you can re flash it? But how do you load files to the flash of the Processor? Do you still use a serial programmer?
 

rjenkinsgb

Well-Known Member
Most Helpful Member
Do you get any beeps when you hold the reset button in for several seconds, as in that article?

Also, I'd pull (and label) the drives in it while trying to reset or reflash it.

It appear the Synology machines do store their main operating system on the storage drives & the flash memory contains the boot and recovery system, if the stored system becomes corrupt.

That's another reason for trying it without drives connected?

More recovery info here; apparently the six pin header is a serial port!
 

Dr Bob

Member
Do you get any beeps when you hold the reset button in for several seconds, as in that article?

Also, I'd pull (and label) the drives in it while trying to reset or reflash it.

It appear the Synology machines do store their main operating system on the storage drives & the flash memory contains the boot and recovery system, if the stored system becomes corrupt.

That's another reason for trying it without drives connected?

More recovery info here; apparently the six pin header is a serial port!
Yes that's right, already done that, I read somewhere that if you get the blue flashing LED, remove all drives and all external connections and switch on and it should load and boot from flash, but I get nothing, just the flashing LED I left it all night, No I get no beeps if I hold in the reset, It was doing a system update and was at around 92% when the power went off

Yes what it says in your link was what I said I will try tomorrow, At least if I see something there's hope, I know the DS418 is getting older now but they are still £350.0 or more to buy, so I hope I can save it, I have read things about people constructing flash files with certain things at certain addresses, I am not good enough to do that, so if I don't see the Marvel prompt I am probably done :-(
 
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rjenkinsgb

Well-Known Member
Most Helpful Member
One of the articles I found mentioned someone buying a replacement, programmed flash IC from the makers for about $35

It may be worth getting in touch with their support and giving it a try, if nothing else works?
 

Dr Bob

Member
One of the articles I found mentioned someone buying a replacement, programmed flash IC from the makers for about $35

It may be worth getting in touch with their support and giving it a try, if nothing else works?
Hi, ok, I have just done a support ticket, what a damn night mare, they keep wanting you to enter information that can only be gleaned with a functioning unit, like please upload the debug dat file, which of course you can't do, anyway I got past it all and asked if they will supply me with a pre programmed flash mem. I aint going to hold my breath but we will see! Thank for your help thus far. Bob
 

Dr Bob

Member
Well! as I said yesterday I connected a serial adapter to it today and turned it on, I was surprised to find it was not as dead as I thought it was and from the messages it was giving on the screen I could see it was trying to sort something out, I had left it running all night a day ago, you would have thought that would have been long enough to sort itself if it was going to, anyway after an hour or so I had a steady green status light and three green drive lights ( There is only three drives in it) I still had the flashing blue though and the screen had stopped streaming and I could see something about needing a reboot, I guess anything it's going to do will take time as it has18TB in it. So I re-booted it and it started streaming again, it looked to me like it was doing all the same things, I even compared the two logs and they looked identical up to about an hour and 20 minutes, anyway suddenly there was a beep! and a steady blue light, I got all excited but there was no led light on the Network socket and with a cable connected I could not see it on the network!
But I had a solid blue, so I thought ok let's try a mode 2 re set, which should erase the operating system but leave the data intact, I pressed and held the reset and got a beep, so I let go and pressed it again and got the three beeps, excellent!, I left it to do it's thing, took two hours but never gave the Orange LED to say the reset was complete, it just sat there with green status and green light drives and a solid blue.
I have just tried the Mode 2 reset again and I'm waiting on the result. I have also updated Synology with this information and a copy of the log, they did come back to me but all they were interested in was proof of purchase to see if it's on guarantee, well of course it isn't it's four years old, I never told them it was, but I expect as soon as they see they are not obliged to help, they will drop me like a hot brick.
If I don't get the Orange LED which says the uit is ready to have an operating system installed, I don't know what to do, I know very little about linux and I don't understand most of what this log is saying unless it's in plain English.
 

Dr Bob

Member
Well, just as I expected, if your £1000.00 unit is out of guarantee get stuffed! What abysmal customer service, they are only interested in selling new units.

"
Hello,

Thank you for your reply.

Unfortunately, we do not provide preprogrammed flash memory and I wanted to check if your device was in warranty so that you could perhaps get a replacement from the retailer as the warranty starts from the proof of purchase and unfortunately you are 2 years out of warranty.

From the information provided, the unit appears to have a fault with the main system board. Unfortunately, this particular unit is no longer covered by the warranty period, and as such, we would not be able to assist with this issue as we do not provide a repair service for out-of-warranty units. In this event, you may wish to find a 3rd party company who offer repairs on Synology products (though, we are unable to recommend any companies for this).

Best Regards
Sam
Technical Support"
 

rjenkinsgb

Well-Known Member
Most Helpful Member
How old is it and is the retailer still trading?

You may have recourse under sale of goods law - "Merchantable quality" and "fit for purpose" apply for six years, in English law. It's guaranteed to be a fight though, most will deny responsibility or say to contact the manufacturer, even if you show them the relevant law in black & white print.

And another possibility, there seem to be a few people on here who have restored units (or some type) that had corrupt boot systems? Possibly worth posting the details of the problem & see if you get any responses?
 

Dr Bob

Member
How old is it and is the retailer still trading?

You may have recourse under sale of goods law - "Merchantable quality" and "fit for purpose" apply for six years, in English law. It's guaranteed to be a fight though, most will deny responsibility or say to contact the manufacturer, even if you show them the relevant law in black & white print.

And another possibility, there seem to be a few people on here who have restored units (or some type) that had corrupt boot systems? Possibly worth posting the details of the problem & see if you get any responses?
Just over three years old, Bought it from Amazon, good luck with arguing with them, they give you 30 days to return and that's it, and they most certainly would say contact the manufacturer. And have you tried speaking to Trading Standards lately? Youy have to contact the citizens advice first and then they decide if they will allow you to have your complaint passed to them, and even if they pass it it doesn't mean they will do anything. There is no real protection for the consumer in this country now, like everything else it's all smoke and mirrors, if you ask they say oh1 yes there is Trading standards and the Ombudsman and as you say all the distance selling regulations etc, but you try and get anyone to enforce them on your behalf. I may well post the problem if I get no where, still having a go at the moment
 

rjenkinsgb

Well-Known Member
Most Helpful Member
I had a problem with an item that was beyond the return time (though weeks rather than years) & got on to the support chat.

The initial response was basically go away, it's past the return time.

So I asked if Amazon allowed sellers that did not comply with English sale of good law.
"Of course not!"
"Just a minute"
..
..
"Your return label has been emailed to you."
 

Nigel Goodwin

Super Moderator
Most Helpful Member
Just over three years old, Bought it from Amazon, good luck with arguing with them, they give you 30 days to return and that's it, and they most certainly would say contact the manufacturer.
Makes no difference if it's Amazon - in the UK all your legal rights are against the retailer you bought it from - however, despite the impression many people give, it's not a blanket multi-year warranty. It give you the right to take them to court where YOU have to prove it was a manufacturing defect - and from what you've said, this fault wouldn't be covered by that (as it was bricked by a failed update).
 

Dr Bob

Member
Makes no difference if it's Amazon - in the UK all your legal rights are against the retailer you bought it from - however, despite the impression many people give, it's not a blanket multi-year warranty. It give you the right to take them to court where YOU have to prove it was a manufacturing defect - and from what you've said, this fault wouldn't be covered by that (as it was bricked by a failed update).
I don't know about that because is it fit for purpose if it was designed with no protection against power failure during update, My Satellite box can be re flashed from USB if that happens, they could have designed it that if it fails to boot it rolls back to the previous version, there's any number of ways to protect it and they did none of them
 

Dr Bob

Member
I had a problem with an item that was beyond the return time (though weeks rather than years) & got on to the support chat.

The initial response was basically go away, it's past the return time.

So I asked if Amazon allowed sellers that did not comply with English sale of good law.
"Of course not!"
"Just a minute"
..
..
"Your return label has been emailed to you."
Seems a bit of a cheek at the age of this one :) I have posted the problem on the forum you recommended, It's waiting for approval at the moment
 

Nigel Goodwin

Super Moderator
Most Helpful Member
I don't know about that because is it fit for purpose if it was designed with no protection against power failure during update, My Satellite box can be re flashed from USB if that happens, they could have designed it that if it fails to boot it rolls back to the previous version, there's any number of ways to protect it and they did none of them
That might be your point of view, but can you provide proof in court, and convince a judge to find for you?.

Trying to do live updates is a VERY fractious process.
 

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