Alternative for 6502 Ben Eater's Computer Kit? (YouTuber, https://eater.net/6502)

[vladimir520]

Tried making a list with alternatives for this YouTuber's 6502 kit. While my list would have looked a lot better and complete, I accidentally clicked away and lost all my progress so I'm out of nerves. Sorry for copy pasting links.

I would like to know if the items on my list are alright.

breadboard: 6 of these: this

CPU: only found 6502 at a low price: this

Versatile Interface Adapter: only found 6522: **broken link removed**

EEPROM: **broken link removed**

SRAM: this

LED Display: from a local store, it's in Romanian, it's alright: https://roboromania.ro/produs/lcd-2x16-caractere-led-blue-display/

NAND Gate: this

crystal oscillator: sadly only found this... which is at 16Mhz and not at 1Mhz... this might be a tad too expensive

tact switches: this

LEDs: this should do lol: **broken link removed**

potentiometer: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/400...chweb0_0,searchweb201602_9,searchweb201603_53

resistors: not a problem, they're way too cheap

capacitor: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/329...chweb0_0,searchweb201602_9,searchweb201603_53

wires: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/328...chweb0_0,searchweb201602_9,searchweb201603_53

I'll look for hookup wires later, I guess.

 

[DrG]

Your first post - welcome!

I would like to know if the items on my list are alright.

I'm trying hard not to make your first response too negative or critical, but I am wondering if you have landed on the best "approach". Additionally, you have said nothing about your experience level.

To answer your question literally, I would say that, at a minimum, your crystal will not work straight away with your 6502. Originally, 1 MHz was "normal" and today, WDC makes a 14MHz version, but I have never heard of a 16MHz version. Additionally, that EPROM is not going to program itself, so it is not alright...without a programmer.

I took a look at that website for the project , but I did not go through it carefully. What stuck out is that he offers a kit of all parts for the project (less 5V PS and EPROM programmer). If you are really on a quest to learn, the price for that kit is the tuition.

If it does not suit your budget, there is SOOOOOOOO much on building your own 6502 board, that I can't help but wonder if a more modest and "slow but sure" approach would be much better.

For example, start here https://wilsonminesco.com/6502primer/index.html

That's my two cents anyways.

 

[vladimir520]

Thank you for answering! Yeah, I'm sorry for not giving a more complete post.. I was in a hurry and deleting my draft by mistake annoyed me a lot. I'm really new. It's a pity I have to get a 1Mhz clock since they're slower and more expensive, but oh well..
I just tried making the kit cheaper, see if it is possible to buy the pieces individiually and get a better deal out of it all. I know I need the EPROM programmer and a 5V power supply. I'll make sure to look over stuff on the Internet and investigate the 6502 further, it seems to be very interesting! I just got into learning x86 Assembly, stumbled upon this cybersecurity channel, LiveOverflow, who has building this 8-bit computer and that's what drew my attention to this kit. I'm amazed to see what was only theory in my head (it's quite a long, dull book) into action, and being able to understand.

Thanks again! Also for not being too negative or critical

 

[DrG]

Thanks for receiving the intended sentiments.

Check out **broken link removed** for a big list of homebrew 6502 projects.

I, and at least a few others here, either started with a 6502 or got some experience with it early on. In fact, I still have my KIM-1, which was the board by MOS technology that made the 6502.

Every once in a while, I think about building a 6502 board (or a Z-80 board) out of retro-respect. But the feeling goes away pretty quickly.

With regard to the crystal, I don't think you have to use one at all - If I am to believe what I read, a R-C oscillator will work. See: https://wilsonminesco.com/6502primer/65c02_RC_OSC.jpg from here.

Good luck with your project and let us know how it is going......and when you end up controlling the world, remember, I wasn't being too critical or negative.

 

[vladimir520]

Lol, thanks! I'll check out the link you've sent me! You've been very friendly and helpful!

 

[Pommie]

Be aware, the 6522 via is (was) very susceptible to static damage, even when soldered onto a board. The commodore 64 used them and got damaged very easily by just touching the rear connector.

Sounds like a lot of work. Good luck.

Mike.

 

[gophert]

Good luck with your project and let us know how it is going......and when you end up controlling the world, remember, I wasn't being too critical or negative.

ha!

if you need a floppy drive controller, let me know, I think I have a few NEC µPD765 sitting in my cabinet.

 

[Mike - K8LH]

Has anyone tried using Rockwell parts instead of WDC parts for this project?

 

[Dick Cappels]

Depending upon what kind of experience you are looking for you might find that a microprocessor is way too much trouble for what you need. I started out on the 6502 but with microcontrollers I found life much easier, especially when flash memory started to replace EPROM. No more keeping a dozen 2716's under UV lamps so they would be ready for the next turn of the firmware. No more wire wrapping five of six sockets together (the old days) to get basic functionality. You might find it easier to try something like a PIC, AVR, or STM32 and save yourself a lot of soldering (or wire-wrapping if you are really ancient).

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

Depending upon what kind of experience you are looking for you might find that a microprocessor is way too much trouble for what you need. I started out on the 6502 but with microcontrollers I found life much easier, especially when flash memory started to replace EPROM. No more keeping a dozen 2716's under UV lamps so they would be ready for the next turn of the firmware. No more wire wrapping five of six sockets together (the old days) to get basic functionality. You might find it easier to try something like a PIC, AVR, or STM32 and save yourself a lot of soldering (or wire-wrapping if you are really ancient).

Yes it's a different world now - a tiny PIC etc. vastly outperforms the early microprocessor system, on every single count.

There's even a PIC32 based computer board that runs BASIC, and even generates the video in the PIC as well, not to mention stores programs on an SD card - you can buy them ready made, or the details to build them yourself are available.

Must admit though, I loved 6502

 

[atferrari]

Every time I felt atracted by the idea of building something old school, the most efective deterrent was the same question: once built and running, what I would do with it?

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

Every time I felt atracted by the idea of building something old school, the most efective deterrent was the same question: once built and running, what I would do with it?

Well historically I wanted to construct a small 6502 board for controlling various electronic and mechanical items - but now a PIC does it FAR better and easier.

 

[atferrari]

Still in my drawers a double (or triple?) set of chips to build something based on the Z80, my first micro ever. Who knows why I did not.

And then the 16C57!!

 

[gophert]

Every time I felt atracted by the idea of building something old school, the most efective deterrent was the same question: once built and running, what I would do with it?

Every time I felt attracted by the idea of rebuilding a classic car, the most efective deterrent was the same question: once built and running, what I would do with it?

 

[Pommie]

I looking at using a Pic18F27Q10 in a current project. It has 64k (words) of flash, 3.5k RAM 1K EEPROM, runs at 64MHz and has every peripheral you could ever need (except USB) and cost less than a dollar in reasonable quantities. Buying one is still only $1.23. Couldn't imagine a multi chip system anymore.

Mike.

 

[Mike - K8LH]

I looking at using a Pic18F27Q10 in a current project. It has 64k (words) of flash, 3.5k RAM 1K EEPROM, runs at 64MHz and has every peripheral you could ever need (except USB) and cost less than a dollar in reasonable quantities. Buying one is still only $1.23. Couldn't imagine a multi chip system anymore.

Mike.

These chips are becoming so increasingly sophisticated. A 680 page datasheet? Amazing...

I had to upgrade my MPLABX and save up to buy a PICKIT 4 just to be able to program some 18F27Q43 samples... and you know what a tightwad I am (grin)...

 

[gophert]

These chips are becoming so increasingly sophisticated. A 680 page datasheet? Amazing...

I had to upgrade my MPLABX and save up to buy a PICKIT 4 just to be able to program some 18F27Q43 samples... and you know what a tightwad I am (grin)...

I bet you use all of the new features vs the old generation version, right?

 

[Mike - K8LH]

I bet you use all of the new features vs the old generation version, right?

Like the PICKIT 3, I pretty much just use it for programming chips. I've never used the debugger...

Or are you referring to the 18F27Q43?

 

[gophert]

Like the PICKIT 3, I pretty much just use it for programming chips. I've never used the debugger...

Or are you referring to the 18F27Q43?

I was referring to the chip but, I'm guessing the answer is the same.

 

[Mike - K8LH]

I was referring to the chip but, I'm guessing the answer is the same.

I'm interested in a couple of the 18F27Q43 peripherals which help reduce the size and cost of my 'retro' CPU projects;

(1) previous chips with CLC (Configurable Logic Cell) peripherals only had four cells and you could only assign four pins as inputs. this chip has eight cells and allows assigning up to eight pins as inputs. The CLC logic is incredibly useful for 'glue' logic on my various 'retro' CPU projects (see example below)...

(2) this is the first chip to sport three NCO (Numerically Controlled Oscillator) peripherals which I can use to generate precise variable clock signals on my 'retro' CPU projects (a variable CPU clock, a variable ACIA clock, and a variable clock for an I2C chip)...