Way to check whether radial or ring circuits?

[regulaz]

well my electrcian wasnt too savvy with rules of electrical wiring and i have all kinds of MCBs in the fusebox. B10/20/32 some have single live wire running from them and some double. some thin some thick.

i need to check whether any ring circuits are present in the home wiring and was hoping if someone knew how to check for it with a multimeter and not having to open all the panels in walls all over the home.

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

No way with a multimeter.

 

[regulaz]

whats the easiest and quickest way then without getting the walls dirty?

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

whats the easiest and quickest way then without getting the walls dirty?

I don't think there is - however, as it's a very location based question, perhaps you should have your location filled in.

I don't know how electricians check? - but I suspect it's simply by removing the sockets and switches and looking at the exposed wiring inside.

Is there some specific reason why you're concerned?.

 

[regulaz]

im mainly concerned with cleaning up the fusebox, it would be a god idea to have one kind of circuit for all circuits.. either radial or ring. so going with radial and getting some RCBOs installed for bath etc. but worried about paint job on walls.

 

[dr pepper]

If its a single socket then its probably a spur, a double socket should be a ring.
If you can plug something in to the socket in question, then trip the breakers manually one by one to see which supplies said socket then if you look at the breaker connection if there are 2 wires then its probably a ring, if theres only one its a spur, this however still isnt a sure way as there could in fact be 2 spurs.

The only way is to pull the socket and see how many wires go to it, 2 sets and its a ring, surely it cant be so difficult and wall wrecking.

Its not necessarily a bodge job if there are various ratings of breakers in the dis box, and various guages of wire connected up, thats quite expected.

 

[kubeek]

Pardon my ignorance, what are these ring and radial circuits?

 

[regulaz]

If its a single socket then its probably a spur, a double socket should be a ring.
If you can plug something in to the socket in question, then trip the breakers manually one by one to see which supplies said socket then if you look at the breaker connection if there are 2 wires then its probably a ring, if theres only one its a spur, this however still isnt a sure way as there could in fact be 2 spurs.

The only way is to pull the socket and see how many wires go to it, 2 sets and its a ring, surely it cant be so difficult and wall wrecking.

Its not necessarily a bodge job if there are various ratings of breakers in the dis box, and various guages of wire connected up, thats quite expected.

thanks for the tips. i've manually tripped breakers and made a map of the whole house checking this way. some MCBs have 2 wires coming off them - they are light points. Power points all have single thick wire per MCB.

There is an inverter point (battery backup for select light/power points in the house) in the store room but only a stabilizer (voltage regulator)connected. couple of MCBs have their wiring routed through this inverters MCB (label says RC MCB) in the fusebox panel, how do i tell if this forms a ring circuit or not? Does it form a ring circuit as a rule?

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

Pardon my ignorance, what are these ring and radial circuits?

Ring mains are the norm in UK, usually having one ring for downstairs and one for upstairs - it's simply a complete ring of wiring - so using 2.5mm twin and earth cable you go from the fuse to the first socket, from that socket to the next, and so on. The last socket then has another wire connecting back to the same fuse in the distribution board, so all sockets on the ring are fed via two pieces of 2.5mm cabling.

Radial sockets are simply fed via a single piece of cable.

 

[dr pepper]

If all your socket mcb's have a single wire to them, and you are in the uk, and your wiring was intalled after 1982 then something is up, ring mains have 2 wires to the breaker.
I'd investigate further and find out exactly whats going on.
The problem in the uk is you cant really trust tradesmen anymore they'd say you need a load of work even if you didnt, unless you know someone reputable.

 

[throbscottle]

Electricians have very fancy meters that can tell all kinds of things about the wiring - even the thickness, as I discovered when we had work done by an electrician recently. So it wouldn't surprise me if a competent, honest electrician could tell you what kind of circuit you have by plugging in a very special meter at various places.

 

[ChrisP58]

im mainly concerned with cleaning up the fusebox, it would be a god idea to have one kind of circuit for all circuits.. either radial or ring. so going with radial and getting some RCBOs installed for bath etc. but worried about paint job on walls.

Are you cleaning it up just for esthetic reasons, or is there some problem that needs to be fixed?

There are many reasons why different breakers are used in the same panel. General purpose wall outlets, overhead lighting, high power appliances, etc. will need different size wires, and different capacity breakers.

And if you don't know EXACTLY what you are doing, it's better to call an expert. A 240 volt shock, even if it doesn't kill you, is not a pleasant experience. And a misswire that results if a fire, could kill your whole family.

 

[regulaz]

Are you cleaning it up just for esthetic reasons, or is there some problem that needs to be fixed?

There are many reasons why different breakers are used in the same panel. General purpose wall outlets, overhead lighting, high power appliances, etc. will need different size wires, and different capacity breakers.

And if you don't know EXACTLY what you are doing, it's better to call an expert. A 240 volt shock, even if it doesn't kill you, is not a pleasant experience. And a misswire that results if a fire, could kill your whole family.

i'm doing this to future proof the fusebox, its a bit old now. and get some spare capacity used. is there a guide for best practices while setting up the fuse box?

i'm looking to work with the electrician this time. they usually take short cuts and leave a lot to be desired if you're not savvy enough these days.

 

[bigal_scorpio]

Hi,

If you have one single wire coming from the top of the breaker (trip, fuse or whatever you prefer) then that circuit cannot be a ring as a ring has a lead AND a return.

This however does NOT mean that the breakers with more than on wire are rings! Often people will run multiple radial circuits from one breaker which is not unusual, especially in older homes.

If you think one particular 30A or 32A circuit could be a ring then the only way to find if this is true means removing a socket (power OFF first) and parting the 2 red (or brown if harmonised wiring) and then power back on carefully checking if they are BOTH live. This I would NOT recommend unless you are really confident and even then you must be willing to get a belt sometimes! Even the best sparkies do the odd time.

Anyway as was mentioned in an earlier thread you really need to put your location on here as not only do methods and values vary greatly from place to place but there may even be a helpful forum member on your doorstep! It could even be me. Fill in your location!

Al

 

[dr pepper]

Das wot I said