sharing my new favorite numbers!

[justDIY]

I have sixteen new favorite numbers, they hold special emotional meaning for me, and I would like to share them with the community. I've written them in hexadecimal since I think it looks nicer oh I also added them to my signature so I can share a little with each post.

Favorite numbers:
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

 

[ThermalRunaway]

Favourite numbers? That's not something I can relate to. For what reason would you prefer one number over another? The only reason I can think of preffering numbers is I would prefer MY six numbers would come up in this week's lottery...

Brian

 

[evandude]

For those who don't follow these sorts of things:
**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**

The industry will have their work cut out for them, trying to send cease and desist orders to every forum/blog/message board/etc on the internet

 

[ThermalRunaway]

Ah now I see! I thought justDIY's original posting was a bit weird.

I can certainly see the appeal of that set of numbers now that I know it's relevance!

Brian

 

[ThermalRunaway]

So let me get this straight. HD DVD had a content lock-in system (DRM protection) to stop unauthorised copying etc. And the whole system is held ransom to one set of codes which can be made use of by the masses to defeat the protection system on a number (all?) titles?

That's a bit of a rubbish protection scheme then, isn't it? A system based around such a weakness is bound to be compromised sooner or later. And it's certainly no good trying to keep it off the internet, that's just not going to happen!

My feeling is that piracy is bad (although I'm not an angel in this respect) but I also find DRM protection to be so restrictive that it's not really fair on the legitimate buyer. I paid for a few Ebooks with DRM protection, and that means I can only view them on my computer. As it happens they were technical Electronics books and I'd have liked to be able to burn them to disc and take them with me for reference wherever I go. Can't do it.

I also own a lot of music DVDs which I'd like to copy so I can play them in my car without having to worry about them being lost, damaged or stolen. Well, unless I defeat the protection systems I can't.

DRM isn't fair, really.

Brian

 

[justDIY]

this encryption code is already being revoked, so it will only work on hd-dvd titles already produced and those currently in various delivery channels.

but the process used to obtain these numbers will work again and again, invalidating the aacs (?) protection used on hd-dvd.

drm is very silly, and the industry just makes it worst by first claiming that aacs encryption would be unbreakable, and then ticking off the internet / hacker community with stuff like censorship and take-down letters.

 

[Marks256]

It would have been cracked soon enough, anyways...


Edit:horrible typo error...

 

[justDIY]

any drm scheme that relies on security through obscurity is fundamentally flawed

encrypting a disc, and then giving the end user all the keys (some hidden on the disc, some hidden in the player) is just asking for trouble.

 

[ThermalRunaway]

I would have been cracked soon enough, anyways...

You "cracked" up a long time ago Marks

 

[Marks256]

CRAP! I just realized there was a typo there!!!!!! It was supposed to be "IT", not "I"... Wow... ...

 

[bloody-orc]

that's what I've been saying all the time HD DVD is BS! blue ray is much much better! As I personally do NOT hack into movie discs I find blue ray much better solution. Also cooler name and bigger size (in bytes not centimeters). More common to see also now days...

 

[Styx]

And here we enter the world of Cryptograph.

Alice wants to send some infomation to Bob and Carol wants this data
Alice encrypts the data and send's to Bob the key via some secure method (post, in meeting...) and then freely sends the data

Carol gets this encrypted data but cannot do anything with it without the key.

GREAT!!! this method works for ssh... you name it


In come AAC and all other DRM scheme's introduced to limit what YOU can you with what you bought and you see that in this case Bob and Carol are the same person and it is this simple un-avoidable fact that means all DRM will fail


funny thing is that the MPAA have said that ANY forum/website/newsgroup posting this number will be sued (last count was in excess of 700,000). HOWEVER... back in the 80's Intel lost a fight to copyright another number... 386 ergo the MPAA cannot do anything as they are trying to claim ownership of a number, a number that if you count for long enough you will REACH

 

[TekNoir]

This "hack" nearly affects Blu-Ray just as much as HD-DVD at this time. Both disc formats use AACS as their primary DRM. The biggest difference is that it is the only DRM scheme used by HD-DVD whereas Blu-Ray additionally employs two other schemes, ROM-Mark (which is intended to block mass production and not individual copies) and BD+ (which has yet to be used on any shipped discs). Either way, no DRM is completely unbreakable/unbypassable.

Is this bad for HD-DVD? DVDs have had all of their various protection schemes broken not long after being introduced. DVDs are doing well. HD-DVDs have a lower production cost than Blu-Ray and have had no compatibility problems to date. Hardware players are cheaper to manufacture and cost less to the consumer. I hardly think that this will be the end of HD-DVD.

Blu-Ray and its technically advanced production format has already encountered problems (higher production costs and a significant flaw rate) and incompatibilities with hardware and software players, including playback on Sony's PS3. With the introduction of additional or even multiple protection schemes on Blu-Ray discs, these incompatibilities can only get worse. This can only cause more problems for Blu-Ray in the future.

I'll leave on two statements:

DRM (in general) only "protects" big businesses and has a history of only hurting consumer experiences, mostly by causing problems during normal usage (such as drastically decreased battery life in portable players and playback incompatibilities).

AND

The more complicated something is, the more that can potentially go wrong.

 

[bloody-orc]

TekNoir if you say, that BR is doing worse than HD then I think you got you facts wrong.... AFAIK BR is selling better in both players AND disks... and BR has better quality. I'm happy to pay a "bit" more for that quality.

Also I somehow like the BDA companies more than DVD Forum ones...

 

[TekNoir]

TekNoir if you say, that BR is doing worse than HD then I think you got you facts wrong.... AFAIK BR is selling better in both players AND disks... and BR has better quality. I'm happy to pay a "bit" more for that quality.

Also I somehow like the BDA companies more than DVD Forum ones...

I'm not saying that Blu-Ray is doing worse than HD-DVD. I say only that this is no real setback for HD-DVD, Blu-Ray's problems are underestimated, and that things may drastically change in the future for both. Personally, I am not for either one. With the current underutilisation of the DVD medium, I highly doubt it will be different on either Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.

(See this link on how current DVDs can be better utilised, though so few have been -- **broken link removed** and also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superbit)

For what it's worth, Blu-Ray has sold more discs and more players than HD-DVD in the same amount of time.

Quality is the same between Blu-Ray and HD-DVD. Both use the same three codecs, MPEG-2 (DVD Standard), MPEG-4 AVC, and VC-1 (Windows Media 9).

Both support the exact same resolutions in use at this time. Blu-Ray has support for some higher resolutions, but they are not being used and most television display monitors don't even support these higher resolutions.

The only differences in quality will be seen in the difference in care given to the encoding process. Just as there are some DVDs where the transfer was immaculate and some where the transfer was horrible, so too will there be Blu-Ray and HD-DVDs with these same good or bad qualities.

As to the size difference, most major studios don't currently even take full advantage of any extra space left on DVD media. Only roughly a third of all DVDs produced contain enough extra content to fill the disc or require extras. I cannot see this changing in the future for the high definition formats. Whether it's 2GB or 4GB, extra unused space is still only extra wasted space.

Both formats will have a rough road ahead.

 

[Styx]

BR may have sold more then HD, but their total sales is still an extreamly small number due to the fact that there is an extreamly small number of people that have the players, the correct TV, the correct cable, the correct...

I mean there are soo many pre-resequits to playing HD disk's and each bit are silly-expensive I am not supprised it aint taken off
Couple that with the Betamax vs VHS wars are fresh in peoples minds and people don't want to be bit by that, couple that with Sony's ability to come up with something technically more advanced the the competition BUT screw it over with really restrictive licencing and price I ain't going anywhere near either format for quite some time

And that is even before I have even mentioned the DRM which would effectivly tie you into a certain format. DRM isn't about stopping piracy, they big execs have even said that. It is about controlling what you do, remember you are no longer buying a product to watch, you are leasing a licence that can at anytime be revolked

 

[Sceadwian]

Blue ray has an increased data density, and hence and increased problem with scratched discs, as with higher data density, a smaller scratch matters more. DVD is about as good as you're going to get without a protected media. Even then it's still a spinning media which means it can only be protected so much. Simply running the medi exposded it to ambient air. I'd hate to be the company that tried to sell the idea of protected atosphere shielded optical discs on a commercial scale =)

It's not 2 or 4 gig.

It's Blue ray 25 gig, HD 15GIG for single layer.
HD currently has the present advantage in that the dupilication media is compatibly with DVD which lets them do two layers cheaply.

Blueray is 50 gig, HD is 30. on double layer.

There are some experimental results with modified optics of blueray discs at 4 or 6 layers... The advantages of superbit media are that much more expanded with the increased storage space. If anyone has ever watched an action movie using compression, storage media size and read back rate are king. Even on a regular TV.

 

[TekNoir]

It's not 2 or 4 gig. Blueray is 50 gig, HD is 30. on double layer.

I was just throwing out unrelated numbers (as the actual number wasn't what was important) when I made that particular statement. My statement is true no matter the size. Unused space is just wasted space, whether it's 2, 4, 30, 50, or 2000 Gigs.

I just don't see it getting used. I have nearly eight-hundred DVDs in this household and I cannot possibly tell you how many, other than saying quite a lot of them, have only a single commentary as the entirety of its extra features, some even less than that. I don't see it changing much just because disc sizes are bigger. They have some extra room now and choose most of the time not to use it.

I don't see size as ever becoming a serious issue, as a factor to choose from, between Blu-Ray or HD-DVD. It's like those people who brag about having 2000 Gigs of space striped in a RAID array across four hard drives in their computer, yet they use in total less than I do on my single 350 Gig drive.

 

[Pommie]

funny thing is that the MPAA have said that ANY forum/website/newsgroup posting this number will be sued (last count was in excess of 700,000). HOWEVER... back in the 80's Intel lost a fight to copyright another number... 386 ergo the MPAA cannot do anything as they are trying to claim ownership of a number, a number that if you count for long enough you will REACH

You must be able to copyright a number. Any program is just a large number. The hex file that you write to a pic chip is just a big number. The pdf file for an ebook is just a (very large) number.

At what point does a number become copyrightable?

Mike.

 

[Sceadwian]

TekNoir, you seem to be missing the point, all that has to be done to use the space more efficiently is to tweak the codec so that it uses all the available space. At Blueray/HD capacities compression only has to be minimal which means images quality goes up. And it allows HD which is what the increased capacity is really useful for. A standard dual layer DVD can just barely hold a modern film at a good quality nowdays. Completly usuitble for HD movies.