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PWM - browns gas generator

Discussion in 'Alternative Energy' started by Flex, Jul 13, 2008.

  1. Flex

    Flex New Member

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    Hi everyone,

    I am trying to make a circuit that will run almost any electrode for a browns gas generator. My knowledge of electrical circuits is somewhat limited, but i do have a residential wiring back ground that has gotten me this fare.

    My main problem is finding a MOSFET and JFet that will work in harmony.
    The electrode that i want to power pulls over 65amp's on 12v DC.
    I intend to run the circuit at about 9kHz to 48kHz or 48kHz to 142kHz.

    here is an image of the circuit I will start with.
    [​IMG]

    If my math is correct that circuit can run 4.3636364 KHz to 48KHz, that is a nice range to start at for now. The driver and MOSFET are to weak for the electrode.
    So i thought if i used a 2N2219A(driver) and a IRF540(MOSFET 28amp 100v 0.077Ohm), but the MOSFET smokes =( .

    Keep in mined the circuit will be installed in a car and will have to be able to with stand the heat(yes I use heat sink for MOSFET all the time).
    I know there are automotive MOSFET's and don't mined using them, But the price for each IC must be reasonable.

    Thank you for your help, ^^
     
  2. audioguru

    audioguru Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    Hi Flex,
    Why does your circuit produce a very high voltage? High voltage makes a spark. You don't want a spark near hydrogen.

    Electrolysis of water uses a high current, not a high voltage.
    Look in Google for Brown Gas Generator Circuit to see.
     
  3. chemelec

    chemelec Well-Known Member

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    Your Dreaming if you expect to run 65 Amps in a car.
    Your Alternator will burn up.
    And Even if it doesn't, The loss of HP from your motor to drive your alternator that hard, will offset any gains from the hydrogen.

    Even though your alternator may be rated at 100 amps, its Actual Continuous Current on a warm day is Probably only 50 to 60 Amps.
    Besides that it needs to supply power to your motor and Many other Possible Accessories.

    NEXT, If you plan to drive that Transformer as shown, It will not work efficiently over that Frequency Range. And at higher frequencys, I doubt your mosfet will work very efficient either.

    Also an IRF540 is Not Suitable. It has too low of a Voltage rating to withstand the Inductive Kickback from your transformer.
    You also need to add Additional Protection for this.

    And there is no reason to use that 2N2222, The 555 will supply a suitable Drive to the mosfet without it.

    Anyway, DREAM ON!
     
  4. dave

    Dave New Member

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  5. Flex

    Flex New Member

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    Sorry for the confusion, the 10T coil will not be used. it is replaced with the browns gas electrode. I posted the curcuit because its kinda close what im making.
     
  6. mramos1

    mramos1 Active Member

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    You can find a number of very cheap kits that will do 0-48K and drive a DC motor (like for a scooter) up to MANY amps. All off 12VDC as well.

    Also, looks like you can remove 4 parts to get what you want from that circuit. What are your electrodes in?
     
  7. Flex

    Flex New Member

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    well i agree, i thought that by PWM on a 60 amp load would bring the amp's down to 30 amp or half its usage. i guess this is not the case. =(

    I can remake the electrode to pull a max of 15 amp's, witch should be a lot better max load and the car can now also support a decent size amplifier for a stereo system.


    I'm a NOOB...
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2008
  8. strokedmaro

    strokedmaro New Member

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    dont let them get you down...however your probably going to find that nothing works better than brute force electrolisis. When you think about it during the gate sequence your not producing anything...I tried several methods, different torroids, winds this that and the only thing it does is generate less the more gate you have.
     
  9. Flex

    Flex New Member

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    the electrode is fully submerged in regular tap water with a 6 inch PVC pipe as the casing. the 60 amp electrode is made up of 14 stainless steel plates(its big, maybe to big). The electrode can also be made with aluminum and i have heard some have done it with carbon plates.

    thx for the info ^^
     
  10. Space Varmint

    Space Varmint New Member

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    These are the same frequencies I have seen used in the Meyers cell. It was said that though his voltage was 1500 volts it operated in the milliamp range. I think you need to replace your MOSFET with an IGBT.
     
  11. audioguru

    audioguru Well-Known Member Most Helpful Member

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    A court found Stanley Meyer guilty of gross fraud about his HHO fuelled car. He would not allow anybody to analyse it. He tricked many people even at the patents office.
     
  12. Flex

    Flex New Member

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    New Schematic, But bad driver & MOSFET still...

    Thx for everyones input on this subject. I have posted a revised schematic of the circuit i would like to make some time in the future. The driver and mosfet is still a problem. but hopefully i will find the right ones to run a smaller electrode(say a 15 amp electrode).

    The schematic is a little more advanced in my eyes, because it uses the Throttle to adjust the pulse.
     

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  13. Space Varmint

    Space Varmint New Member

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    Hey Guru! This is mrgone...lol. Anyway I don't know much about Meyers, I was just stating what I had read and I am interested in doing some experimenting using his techniques. But to the OP, did you consider an IGBT and another thing, if that MOSFET is burning up, you probably need to up the size of your heat-sink.
     
  14. Hero999

    Hero999 Banned

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    We're not trying to get at him, just trying to save him the disappointment of spending lots of time and money on something that won't give him the desired result.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2008
  15. Speakerguy

    Speakerguy Active Member

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    We should ban anything about Brown's Gas unless it's a fart joke thread. And we should probably ban those too.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2008
  16. Space Varmint

    Space Varmint New Member

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    So you don't think there are any advantages to raising the voltage and modulating it with a frequency?
     
  17. Torben

    Torben Well-Known Member

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    Actually Brown's Gas is real and pretty interesting. Its supposed application as a way to run vehicles on water is a load of dingos' kidneys, though. A little thing called the Laws of Thermodynamics means it cannot work. You'd have more luck sticking a windmill on top of the vehicle to generate electricity from the vehicle's slipstream (i.e., still no luck).

    Maybe just the pseudo-science threads should be locked.


    Torben
     
  18. Flex

    Flex New Member

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    Im not trying to make enough HHO to fully run the car, just enought to save some money at the pump.

    By using a PWM circuit you could increas the efficency of power consumption.


    PS: Dont ban my thread :eek:
     
  19. Hero999

    Hero999 Banned

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    Then buy a more efficient car or a small motorcycle and keep the car for when you need to take passengers..
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2008
  20. Torben

    Torben Well-Known Member

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    Your vehicle will expend more energy creating the gas than it will regain by burning it. Your efficiency will go down, not up. Unless physics has been repealed, that is.


    Torben
     
  21. chemelec

    chemelec Well-Known Member

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    Definately NOT!
    And Forget all Meyers CRAP!

    But if your going to do this, Keep your Total Current to 20 Amps or Less so it doesn't overload your alternator.

    Plain Tap water is the Poorest option.
    KOH in the water is Best, But AVOID ALUMINUM!
    Just Tap Water results in the Greatest Resistance, so for a Given Current, it also produces the greatest Power Draw as well as Excessive Heating in the cell. (So WORST EFFICIENCY)

    PWM Helps control Current, But as cells get hot they Increase in Current. So Watch your current or Build the Current Limited PWM circuit that is shown in the Projects, on my site.
    Besides Frequency and Pulse Width, It allows you to set a Maximum Current Limit with a third control.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2008
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