press'n'peel blue

[evandude]

Hi,

I have been making PCB's using toner transfer on photo paper for years, and I've gotten pretty good at it... I can make a usable board every time, first try, but there's almost always at least a couple of broken traces and other such small things that need to be fixed.

I have never used press'n'peel blue because of the price ($1.50 a sheet, versus about $10 for 30 sheets of the photo paper I use) but lately i've been shifting more toward surface-mount stuff and I'm starting to think that if the press'n'peel blue can do a better job, then it might be worth it. Plus, a pack of 20 sheets would last me a year, especially if i only use small pieces at once, instead of full sheets, and $30 a year isn't that bad.

So I want to ask anyone who has experience... is press'n'peel blue really that good? They claim it can do traces down to 5 mils, which also leads me to believe it is good for just about any fine-pitch stuff. How well does it transfer, ie, do you get a lot of broken traces, or does it transfer cleanly?

Thanks,

-Evan

 

[fsahmed]

If u iron properly, applying equal pressure & heat on every spot u will get perfect results. Make sure that u dont iron directly, iron over a piece of cloth keeping the press n peel beneath it.

With press n peel, there r no broken tracks or any problems at all. The results come out like as if the copper has been mechanically removed. But it will take a sheet or two before u perfect the art though if u have practiced iver toner transfer, u neednt worry about that too.

 

[evandude]

Cool.

I was thinking, does anyone (in the US) happen to have a bunch lying around and wouldn't mind sending (and/or selling) me a small amount? maybe 1/4 or 1/2 a sheet. Just enough to try it out making one board, with enough for a screwup or two.

lowest quantity i've found is 5 sheets online, about $10 plus like 8 for shipping... if i could get just part of a sheet from someone that would be awesome (fit in an envelope = 35 cents shipping)

 

[evandude]

Anyone else with experience to share?

 

[mstechca]

Yes

Here is how I make my boards.

Buy some candle wax.
Buy a dental pick or get yourself a thin and sharp pin. The thinner the pin, the denser your design can be.

Total price: < $5. I paid about $2.50. 50 cents for 4 large 10 inch candles which can do about 10 boards.

Now melt the wax (I use my soldering iron for everything, including wax LOL) onto the side of the board where you do the design. Let it cool off. (wait about 2 minutes).

Get yourself a hold of a bright light. now carve a shape in the corner of the board. If what you carved is extremely shiny and the rest of the board is dull (not so shiny), then you can start your design.

whatever copper is scraped will be removed in the later stage. So if you want two copper rectangles, you would make a line down the center of the board.

Now etch your board. I use ferric chloride. As soon as everything looks ok, then you can remove the wax. I actually use sandpaper to sand it off. Yes, some people hate that idea, but it is fast!

Now go ahead and solder. The only error you could possibly make is that you didnt scrape enough wax off!

 

[evandude]

i'm thinking of switching to press'n'peel because i'm using more extremely small parts. I'd love to see you make a complex board with SSOP pitch parts by carving it out in wax... :roll: and good luck with anything that has hundreds of connections... :lol:

 

[bryan1]

Hiya evandude,
Eh mate I've got a full pack of about 5 sheets off memory I haven't used yet so I can send you some over but I live in Oz. So p.m me if your interested I'm sure we could work something out

Cheers Bryan

 

[adamthole]

I used them, and I had terrible luck with them. At the time I thought that the melting temperature of the paper was lower than that of my toner. I never got a single sheet to work, and sent everything back. However, I could have been doing something wrong, as those were my first attempts at Laser PCB. (I now use staples paper, with very few problems)

 

[Pommie]

I've used them and didn't have any problems until my laser printer started running out of toner (sp?).

Some tips,

Make sure your not running out of toner.
Don't use steam.
Do make sure your iron is at 150C (300F).
Do allow time for the copper to heat up - 3 mins on each iron sized area.
Debur the edges - I used tin snips to cut the board and if I didn't debur it then the tracks near the edge lifted.
Do it (iron) on a hard surface. Ironing boards stop you getting an even contact.

HTH

Mike.

 

[evandude]

Okay. Well as I said, i've been making boards with toner transfer with photo paper for years, so all of those things are things that I'm already used to.

and luckily for me, i just replaced my toner cartridge so i'll be set for quite some time.

But i'm glad it's got a good reputation, I think i'm going to have to try it. If it solves the little minor problems that I see with photo paper, then it's worth the money.

 

[pike]

Yes

Here is how I make my boards.

Buy some candle wax.
Buy a dental pick or get yourself a thin and sharp pin. The thinner the pin, the denser your design can be.

Total price: < $5. I paid about $2.50. 50 cents for 4 large 10 inch candles which can do about 10 boards.

Now melt the wax (I use my soldering iron for everything, including wax LOL) onto the side of the board where you do the design. Let it cool off. (wait about 2 minutes).

Get yourself a hold of a bright light. now carve a shape in the corner of the board. If what you carved is extremely shiny and the rest of the board is dull (not so shiny), then you can start your design.

whatever copper is scraped will be removed in the later stage. So if you want two copper rectangles, you would make a line down the center of the board.

Now etch your board. I use ferric chloride. As soon as everything looks ok, then you can remove the wax. I actually use sandpaper to sand it off. Yes, some people hate that idea, but it is fast!

Now go ahead and solder. The only error you could possibly make is that you didnt scrape enough wax off!

try doing that when your etchant is well above the melting point of the wax. Ammonium persulphate and ferric chloride require 70' celsius for optimum etching. So yes it will etch but at a slower rate. And the etchant wont last very long because you cant heat it up.