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lasertag gun ir sensor question

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breadboardguy

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I want to make a simple laser tag gun with a led as emitter and a ir sensitive diode as receiver, it will be a compact unit i hope firing more then 100 meters easily. but i dont know what receiver to use, i know that there are some tsop 17.. very cool receivers but 2 $ dollars each and i need 12, its getting out of budget so i tought of simply diodes( if it works) but i know that they produce a leakage relative to the irradiation of it, and i need to get an 5 volt to make it work so:

How can i get the .1 volt to 2 volts leak to always 5 volts?
and will it be sensible enough? what do you think i should do?

In my simple cicruit that i provide, i only use 555, no pic(even if i have experience in programming i never compiled stuffed into microcontrollers like 16c...) because i dont want to get into pic prog. for now so thats it( i know that there might be bugs in the circuit, but its a first draw so dont care of it).
when the gun is hit, a long buzz is heared, when you shoot, a short buzz is heard.The gun will be put in a pvc gun style casing.

Please post back and thank you if you do so.
 

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Sceadwian

Banned
how can i get the .1 volt to 2 volts leak to always 5 volts?

Sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense there is currently no question to answer.

 

breadboardguy

New Member
Okay, i will make a clearer queation:

How can i make a system enough sensible to sense a ir ray with diodes and producing an voltage output of 5 volt if the diode is irradiated ?

Why do you say there is no question? Its in red. i just dont know so i ask you.
 

Sceadwian

Banned
You'll need to use a laser anyways, a LED would have such a wide beam that you wouldn't even have to point it in the general direction of the person to score a heat.
RED laser modules are cheap, you can gut one from a 5 dollar laser pointer. You'll get 100meters out of that more than likley.
 
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breadboardguy

New Member
If you look in the schem, there is a magnifiyng lense that improves considerably the range and on the website that i found that, they said it goes 200 meters, so i think 100 meters is reachable.

BUT I NEED TO MAKE AN SENSOR AND I DONT HAVE A SINGLE CLUE HOW TO AMPLIFY THE LEAK TO 5 VOLTS AND IF IT IS ENOUGH SENSIBLE.

Nobody know's about infrared transmitting and receiving?

I do need your help so please, just give me a hint.
 

Sceadwian

Banned
breadboardguy, you need to work on your basic electronic terminology "Leak .2 to 5 volts" Doesn't mean anything.

After you restated your question it looks like you want to amplify the photo diode signal to get a 5 volt output. The 555's (however you have them set as your schematic shows absolutly no detail) should be broadcasting bursts of modulated light. You also have to only detect this modulated light, which will require more circutry than I'm sure you're familiar with. You could use IR tv remote receivers which do all of this for you but those are gonna be a buck or two as you've found out. There's really no way to get around that price.
 
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breadboardguy

New Member
i know, the circuit that is there was if i was using the tsop 1738 but it is not an option. You are right, what i meaned was how can i amplify the photodiode signal ( leak, beacause it is reverse biaised ) ?
Will it get a easier detecting if i send a specific hz that has to be decoded by a circuit or just with constant irradiation?

Sorry for my not clear question, i will try to avoid these situations in the future.
 

gabeNC

Member
You'll need to use a laser anyways, a LED would have such a wide beam that you wouldn't even have to point it in the general direction of the person to score a heat.
RED laser modules are cheap, you can gut one from a 5 dollar laser pointer. You'll get 100meters out of that more than likley.

Here's an excerpt from "The Complete Tagger" PDF by Dave Bodger circa Jan '06.

There are now some quite reasonably priced units available from suppliers such as Maplins, which may make
them appear appealing. If you have ever thought of fitting one to your tag gun for use as a real targeting laser -
PLEASE DO NOT. Because of the widespread use of telescopic sights on many guns, even a low powered
laser is hazardous to people's eyes. Once the beam has been concentrated another 10 or more times by a scope,
the intensity is enough to do permanent damage to someone's retina. A 1mW Class II laser, the weakest sold by
Maplins, is NOT eye safe!
As far as I am aware, ALL lasers are BANNED in all LRP tag games. Even if someone produced what they
thought was an "eye safe" laser, the game organisers would have no way of determining the safety of such a
device on the day. Unfortunately the standard method of checking the safety of LRP weapons (being hit with it
yourself) is not acceptable here. (Hmm - let's just shine this laser in your eyes for a few minutes and see if you
go blind !)
The lasers used in games such as Quasar and Laser Quest are Class I, and so low powered that you can hardly
see them in anything other than total darkness; also telescopic sights are not used in those games and the
targeting area is the chest, not the head as it is in LRP tag games so the risk of prolonged eye exposure and
consequent damage is reduced.
The word "Laser" in the name "Laser Tag" is there just for effect. The infra red beams we use are thousands of
times less concentrated than a real laser beam and are little more dangerous than a TV remote controller at a
distance.
 

Sceadwian

Banned
So drop the voltage on the laser module gabe..
 

gabeNC

Member
So drop the voltage on the laser module gabe..

Have you ever played with this stuff... seriously... just humbly asking? I just think advice using an actual laser would be a bad idea, so I forwarded some of the info I've read. I have not built one yet, but I have done alot of reading and research (part of why I ended up on this site). My kids have a "toy" version tagger, has a range of probably 100' through the top lens and a "shotgun" type for the bottom lens, range of about 25'. They are IR.
 

Sceadwian

Banned
Yes gabe, it's pretty trivial to dim a laser module, you just provide it with less current. I would use an IR laser module though. They're still not safe though and harder to calibrate cause you can't see them. Even being IR the power will still fry the back of your retinas.
 
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HarveyH42

Banned
Yes gabe, it's pretty trivial to dim a laser module, you just provide it with less current. I would use an IR laser module though. They're still not safe though and harder to calibrate cause you can't see them. Even being IR the power will still fry the back of your retinas.
Probably worse, since your eyes don't respond to IR, you won't blink, squint, or dilate to protect your self, like visible light...
 

HarveyH42

Banned
Wouldn't want to find out, my eyes are bad enough. Don't think it would be a good idea to stare directly into, and try to figure if its working or not...
 

Sceadwian

Banned
rofl
Nice one gabe, looks like an IR bazooka =)
If you need to test IR leds use a digital camera,
 

gabeNC

Member
rofl
Nice one gabe, looks like an IR bazooka =)
I suppose if I used that "bazooka", I would probably knock out all of their hit points with one shot! here's an interesting rocket-type tagger.

This dude has way..way too much time on his hands.

Finkbuilt Blog Archive Hacking Laser Tag


If you need to test IR leds use a digital camera,
I've read that a video camera on "night shot" mode can pick up the IR too... haven't tried it though.

How would you use the digital camera? High ISO?
 

Sceadwian

Banned
Night shot mode does nothing more than remove the hot plate (the IR blocking filter) from the camera. All CMOS cameras even with a hot plate are still sensitive to near IR light. The optical filters that cameras use just simply aren't enough to get rid of it all.
 
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