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how do you mount your components

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Re: reply

aibelectronics said:
i've downloaded the graph, nigel, thanks :)
it seems to be more fitted to small project works, wouldn't do bad with some expanding :)

It's double size, and scaled for A4 paper, the program Graph Paper Lite allows you to print it in various magnifications, and on any paper size your printer supports.
 
Re: reply

aibelectronics said:
you use the copper side!!!
can i see a sample of your work?

I think you've misunderstood him?, he doesn't mount the components on the copper side, just that he designs the layout with the coppper side upwards. Most people probably design with the copper side down?, I certainly do - but it makes no difference really, just as long as you keep EVERYTHING the same way up :lol:
 
TekNoir said:
When I'm away from my computer, I use the stripboard layout template available from the page below printed out and kept in a loose-leaf binder.

https://www.eleinmec.com/article.asp?11

That's well and good for old times sake but Nigel did put me onto Lochmaster layout software, and not only me but a few other people agree designing different circuits with the above software is the g.o. If I'm away I just print out a few strip boards and do it on paper then when I get home I can use the test feature in lochmaster before I make the board. It's the way to go I reckon at least.

Cheers Bryan :D
 
bryan1 said:
That's well and good for old times sake but Nigel did put me onto Lochmaster layout software, and not only me but a few other people agree designing different circuits with the above software is the g.o. If I'm away I just print out a few strip boards and do it on paper then when I get home I can use the test feature in lochmaster before I make the board. It's the way to go I reckon at least.

Cheers Bryan :D

First of all, I admit that I use Lochmaster (and have for quite some time now).

But... there is something to be said about complete uniformity and customizability (I've edited the Office version to suit my tastes), not to mention portability. For you to print out your sheets, you need access to the computer on which Lochmaster is stored and have to accept exactly the format in which it prints. I keep a PDF of the above available on a USB thumbdrive (along with the free, less than 1MB in size Foxit PDF reader) that I carry with me always and from which I can print from absolutely any computer anywhere in the world. (I formerly traveled a lot and oftentimes for extended periods.) I can even store (and edit) the PDF on my PocketPC. Both options are far more portable than carrying around my [rather large] laptop computer. Even without my loose-leaf binder full of pre-printed pages, I still have very real access to easily making more.

I'm not here to show disrespect for the wonderful software that is Lochmaster (I also like and use sPlan), but there is something to be said for portability and intuitively familiar format, especially when you need it right that moment. (Nothing like having an idea and not being able to document it properly, only to forget important facts later. I wonder how many wondrous inventions have been lost to this folly in the past...)

By the way... If you like Lochmaster, give Muvium's Virtual Bradboard a try. It is somewhat similar, supports simulations, including some microcontrollers, and is free. I happen to use both, though for entirely different purposes. Get a copy of the last version (a new version is in development) **broken link removed**.
 
TekNoir said:
By the way... If you like Lochmaster, give Muvium's Virtual Bradboard a try. It is somewhat similar, supports simulations, including some microcontrollers, and is free. I happen to use both, though for entirely different purposes. Get a copy of the last version (a new version is in development) **broken link removed**.

It's the second time I see you recommending Virtual Breadboard when Lochmaster has been brought up, and although I have it installed and give it a try from time to time, I still fail to see what it has anything to do with Lochmaster.

Lochmaster is great to plan Veroboard/stripboard layout. It's easy to use and very intuitive. It has a test feature that's very useful, both during layout and actual assembly and soldering. I don't print anything from Lochmaster, I just look at the screen, and along with my soldering iron, my DMM and the test feature, I get a working circuit in almost no time now.

Virtual Breaboard, in my humble opinion, is trying to do too much. It's a weird mix of schematic, layout and simulation software all crammed up into a single workspace interface. I wildly prefer Livewire for schematics and simulation.

What do you use VBB for?
 
TekNoir said:
For you to print out your sheets, you need access to the computer on which Lochmaster is stored and have to accept exactly the format in which it prints.

Which is true for most software, no matter how convenient you believe PDFs are.

TekNoir said:
I keep a PDF of the above available on a USB thumbdrive (along with the free, less than 1MB in size Foxit PDF reader) that I carry with me always and from which I can print from absolutely any computer anywhere in the world.

Provided it has a USB port or Acrobat Reader or an internet connection...

TekNoir said:
(I formerly traveled a lot and oftentimes for extended periods.) I can even store (and edit) the PDF on my PocketPC. Both options are far more portable than carrying around my [rather large] laptop computer.

So what you're saying is that your PocketPC is not powerful enough to run Lochmaster, your laptop is too big or airplane/train seats are too small.

Also, your edits on the PDF are useless when you want to take the layout back in Lochmaster. You might as well just draw on your printout - which you could have conveniently printed out at home before leaving - and apply your edits to the original when you get back home.

PDFs weren't meant to be edited by users anyway. It's a format designed to look and print exactly the same on any kind of hardware and software configuration.

TekNoir said:
I'm not here to show disrespect for the wonderful software that is Lochmaster (I also like and use sPlan), but there is something to be said for portability and intuitively familiar format, especially when you need it right that moment.

And there's something to be said about intuitive software.

To me, your whole geeky story is all about trying to fit a Fisher Price square block into the triangle hole. You've managed to do it by melting the square even though it wasn't designed to do it and there's a conveniently cube-shaped hole right next to it.

Work is still possible while traveling. Productivity with less than a hundred bucks worth of technology on you, now that's true portability.
 
TekNoir said:
I happen to use both, though for entirely different purposes.

I use Lochmaster just as you do. I use Virtual Breadboard for rapid prototyping. Lochmaster allows you to do an electrical connection check, but VBB has basic emulation, including for some PIC microcontrollers. This allows one to see more of an immediate affect of changing something around. It enables me to breadboard things just like I would at my workbench, without actually getting hands-on I suppose. Not to mention the time required to gather and test components and other myriad pre-design considerations. It is basic in what it does, I will grant anyone that, but it is one of the best meshes between conventional schematic software, which isn't very visually intuitive, and working on an actual breadboard. It gives one the feeling that one is actually building something as opposed to being perpetually in the design stage.

Joel Rainville said:
Virtual Breaboard, in my humble opinion, is trying to do too much. It's a weird mix of schematic, layout and simulation software all crammed up into a single workspace interface. I wildly prefer Livewire for schematics and simulation.

I completely agree with this statement about trying to do too much, though I prefer Proteus for schematic capture and simulation.

Joel Rainville said:
Provided it has a USB port or Acrobat Reader or an internet connection...

Foxit PDF reader allows me to read or print PDFs on any computer, whether they have any Adobe software installed or not. My only requirement is a USB port, which nearly every computer since 1997 has been manufactured to include.

Joel Rainville said:
So what you're saying is that your PocketPC is not powerful enough to run Lochmaster, your laptop is too big or airplane/train seats are too small.

You either don't own a PocketPC (or a PalmPilot for that matter) or are just trying to argue for the sake of arguing. This is a moot point since Lochmaster wasn't compiled to run on the StrongArm processor used in most PocketPCs.

Joel Rainville said:
Also, your edits on the PDF are useless when you want to take the layout back in Lochmaster. You might as well just draw on your printout - which you could have conveniently printed out at home before leaving - and apply your edits to the original when you get back home.

PDFs weren't meant to be edited by users anyway. It's a format designed to look and print exactly the same on any kind of hardware and software configuration.

Who wants to put them back into Lochmaster? I hardcopy everything. One harddrive crash and one failed backup too many taught me to never rely on computer technology alone. (Especially when it runs Windows as an operating system.) Your statement about PDFs is exactly why I use them. They come out looking the same despite the computer, operating system, or printer that I print them from. It's that uniformity thing that I mentioned.

Joel Rainville said:
To me, your whole geeky story is all about trying to fit a Fisher Price square block into the triangle hole. You've managed to do it by melting the square even though it wasn't designed to do it and there's a conveniently cube-shaped hole right next to it.

This statement has no relevance whatsoever to this topic. My original statement was that I prefer to use printed sheets (and gave a link to an example) as do thousands of other people in this world for the past fifty years.

Either you can use Virtual BreadBoard or not. Quite frankly, I could care less. I just mentioned it because I find it useful. There are more people on this board than just you and if only one other person finds it useful who previously did not know about it, then I consider my advice well placed. Apparently, there are enough people who share my opinion that VBB is useful that it has been featured in three different magazines. And that's only the ones that I am aware of...

This board used to be a place where one could come to give and receive help and find the constructive thought of one's peers. It has turned, over time, into one large heap of over-opinionated, big-headed snobs.

I would ask that you please send any further comments regarding my posts on this topic to my message box.

Edit: Posted wrong final copy.
 
TekNoir said:
It has turned, over time, into one large heap of over-opinionated, big-headed snobs.

Sorry if I came accross as an "over-opinionated big-headed snob". I was trying to make my points as clear as possible. But looking back at my last post, it's awfully lacking in smileys, and it does sound rather harsh.

Reading your reply, I think there's some information I missed in your previous posts. Sometimes my limited knowledge of the english language makes me miss subtleties and details in the text... and sometimes I just might miss a few posts in a multipage thread...

I appreciate your contributions to this forum and it would be sad if the tone of one my post made you think less of Electro Tech. It is not *my* forum, and even if I do act like a smartass from time to time, there is still a lot of nice people around here, and tons of info to learn and enjoy electronics. Don't let me ruin the experience. Ignore me as needed ;)

Again, sorry.
 
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Joel Rainville said:
Again, sorry.

well all is well that ends well :)

back to our topic, i've seen chaps who did all the connecting work on the copper side of the wire-wrapped vero-board. the top is very neat: there are no wires at all; i'm not sure of the bottom though because they didn't post the pictures of that side.
have you ever employed this method? how effective is it? how reliable?
 
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