First Time Making PCB: Suppliers, Hints, ETC

[Souper man]

Its my first time making a pcb, well actually when I typed This it was etching, So I was Wondering:

What to get:
What to Use:
Suppliers of stuff:
Hints:
any other thing:

Also, where can I find really small drill bits, along with hints on IC holes

 

[Nigel Goodwin]

along with hints on IC holes

Use round ones!

 

[Hero999]

• 1mm is good enough for most components.
• SMT components can be good as you don't need to do much drilling, there again through hole can be good too (especially resistors) as you can lay many tracks underneath them.
  I normally use the toner transfer process with magazine paper for simple boards ant the photo process for complex boards that need a high degree of accuracy.
• I haven't bought any PCB stuff for years, I got some sodium persulphate crystals from Maplins and some boards about eight years ago and for the most part it's lasted me, I have borrowed a few boads from college before I left though.

 

[Souper man]

Nigel: Oh! thats where I went wrong (ha ha)!

Hero: I am a super noob, so sodium persulphate and magazine paper could mean anything to me.

I AM JUST STARTING THIS TODAY LOL!

 

[Souper man]

Also, it says to dump the ferric chloride down the toilet! Is this right?!?

 

[HarveyH42]

First, search this forum for threads about making PCBs, toner transfer, drill bits... We go through this about once a month, so plenty of good reading, some even a little amusing.

Search the web, there are at least 2 good sites with are almost totally dedicated to making PCBs at home, many good links to suppliers. More than you probably need to know.

Electronic Goldmine has carbide PCB bits, had some on sale a month ago 50-$29, if you have a drill press, likely a lifetime supply. In a dremel or regular drill, probably a year or two worth... Think the also had a small assorted size deal around $5, likely best to start with.

Anyway, no matter what method or tools you use, the number on all time, most important thing to remember... Clean the copper well, and keep your greasy fingers off it until it's done etching.

 

[Souper man]

I finished etching, and I made a simple LED flasher using a 555. It looks and works good. I think i am going to try PCB more often!

 

[Speakerguy]

Advanced Circuits always does a whiz-bang job for me

 

[mramos1]

I finished etching, and I made a simple LED flasher using a 555. It looks and works good. I think i am going to try PCB more often!

What did you use to transfer the toner with? Magazine paper? I saw a tutorial on the internet and it does work as hero999 says. But the fellow mentioned taping it to a sheet of paper. That was where I went wrong, he also drops in it boiling water to remove the paper.

 

[Souper man]

i used perminent marker, but how do i use the magazine paper way? Do i use the same echant and eching process? if so, Plz tell me!

 

[Hero999]

Nigel: Oh! thats where I went wrong (ha ha)!

Hero: I am a super noob, so sodium persulphate and magazine paper could mean anything to me.

I use the following procedure for most of my boards:

1. Print the design on to glosy magazine paper (the sort used for most magazines in newsagents) using a laser printer.
2. Iron it on to the copper clad board; use the highest temperature setting and apply as much presure as you can.
3. Soak it in cold water for about ten miniutes.
4. Stick it in a tray of warm etching solution, I use Press 'n' Peel etch (a mixture of sodium persulphate/sodium bisulphate) and wait for it to finish etching.
5. Scrub off the remaining toner using stel wool and soapy water.

 

[dknguyen]

Remember that you cannot fit a square pin into a circular hole if the hole has a diameter equal to one side of the pin.

And don't bother etching away all the copper on the PCB that's not needed unless it's in under or around an area that is sensitive to extra capacitance like clocks, etc. Wastes chemicals and causes waste. Just ground it- provides more stability and prevents your board from warping (the ratio of copper-plastic is more equal throughout the board).

 

[mramos1]

dknguyen, I know you are right, there was a test on that when I was maybe 4 years old. Damn thing did not fit, but a bigger kid got his square peg in the round hole and his face was all red...

On a side note. If you use Eagle, go to the pad layer and use the poly tool and cover your open areas and leave the chucks of copper on the board and save etchant.

 

[3v0]

Name your ground GND then type in "polygon GND". It will prompt you to draw the polygon. Draw around the edges of the board and all the areas it fills will be connected to GND.

Use change ISOLATE to set the distance between the fill and other signals.

It will not fill till you use RATSNEST.

Once you do POLYGON GND you can not change the value of ISOLATE. You have to undo the POLYGON cmd and then change ISOLATE.

HTH

 

[bananasiong]

I use the following procedure for most of my boards:

1. Print the design on to glosy magazine paper (the sort used for most magazines in newsagents) using a laser printer.
2. Iron it on to the copper clad board; use the highest temperature setting and apply as much presure as you can.
3. Soak it in cold water for about ten miniutes.
4. Stick it in a tray of warm etching solution, I use Press 'n' Peel etch (a mixture of sodium persulphate/sodium bisulphate) and wait for it to finish etching.
5. Scrub off the remaining toner using stel wool and soapy water.

Must it be that kind of paper? Can normal document paper be used?

 

[dknguyen]

dknguyen, I know you are right, there was a test on that when I was maybe 4 years old. Damn thing did not fit, but a bigger kid got his square peg in the round hole and his face was all red...

On a side note. If you use Eagle, go to the pad layer and use the poly tool and cover your open areas and leave the chucks of copper on the board and save etchant.

I'm just saying because I did that on a recent circuit board. lol

 

[Hero999]

Must it be that kind of paper? Can normal document paper be used?

Yes but I've never tried it, magazine paper normally works best for me and it's the cheapest option as it's recycled.

Others here swear by photo paper and other proprietary papers like Press 'n' Peel but I've never bothered, if I want high quality I use the UV process.

 

[mneary]

Once you do POLYGON GND you can not change the value of ISOLATE.

correction: The command change isolate (distance) (e.g. change isolate 20) and then click on the polygon outline. Since the outline isn't displayed, you do need to remember where you put it.

 

[mneary]

Can normal document paper be used?

The key feature of the magazine paper is that it has a smooth coating to keep the toner on the surface. Most ordinary document paper is porous and the toner is pressed into the fabric.

 

[3v0]

[SIZE=-1]Key issues with or without commercial transfer paper include keeping your fingers off the clean board and the transfer paper. What follows are tips and info that has allowed me to make very good SS, DS, and silkscreens using the toner transfer method.

Some people make a big deal out of cleaning the board. Just scrub till evenly clean and brite with a green scotch brite pad and Dawn dish soap. Lay it on the counter and put some elbow grease into it. Rinse with water. Do not touch it again except with a paper towel to dry it.

Treat the transfer paper with care too. If you touch it prior to printing you run the risk of the toner falling off prior to or during transfer. If you touch the toner after printing the toner will fail to stick to the copper.

The next problem is to transfer the toner from the transfer paper to the board. The hands down easy way to do this is with a laminator. They provide even heat and pressure. If you do not have a laminator there are instructions on the PulsarProFx site on how to use a large wood dowel with a clothes iron to fake one. A clothes iron by itself can be difficult to use.
The Pulsar site also has instructions on how to determine what heat setting to use on a clothes iron.
The pulsar has a lot of good info even if you do not use their product.

Removing the paper after transfer. If you use a commercial paper a minute of two in a warm water bath and it falls off. With gloss high clay content paper a few minutes of soaking in hot water should do it. Boiling ?

It costs a few dollars to get into the commercial transfer papers but the cost per square inch is low. They make the process easier to get right and seem to provide finer detail then can be hand without them. I can run 2 lines between .1" pitch IC pads without making the pads smaller. Have done 3 in tests but have never found the need to do so on an actual board. I am using .01" traces without problems.

[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]The commerical transfer papers from https://www.PulsarProFx.com can be found at Mouser [/SIZE]5165-TTS10. Ten [SIZE=-1]8.5x11in sheets are $15. They also offer a foil that can be laminated on top of the foner to further seal pin holes that are in the toner for about $10.
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The press and peel from https://www.techniks.com/ run $33 for 20 8.5x11in sheets. I am not as familiar with their products.

Some things to keep in mind.

With the commercial transfer products the laser printer you use is often the limiting factor. You transfer is as only as good as the toner pattern the printer makes.

Most printers are better at alignment across the page then they are down the page. Position the artwork across rather then down the page.

The toner is liquified twice. Once when fused to the paper by the printer and again when transferred to the copper. To get dense toner the printer is set to its darkest setting. This much toner can creep/flow a bit when liquid. This is not a problem with most boards but it is a source of error in the process. If you iron the crap out of it or run it through the laminator too many times you can make it worse.

[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Not 100% sure on this one. [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Some printers can only deliver so much toner to a given area of the paper. If you do a fill you are more apt to have problems with traces. But if you are having problems when using a pour try turing the pour off.

Again keep it clean. Wash your hands often to remove the oil from you fingrer tips. I go a step further. When I start on a new sheet of transfer paper I attach a sheet of normal printer paper to the active/printing side with a few tabs of blue painters tape (3M). It is low tack and comes off easier then most tapes. Then I can layout and cut the needed bits without danger of touching. When a tab is cut away add a new one.

Eagle
I have found that if you extend the dimension lines so as to create a tic-tac-toe looking design with the board in the middle it makes aligning the transfer paper to the carrier sheet (normal paper with the board location printed on it) easier. Simple but helpful

When printing a pattern for the top side of the board (DS or SS surfaced mount) check the Mirror box in addition to the Black and Solid which should be used all the time.

ERC and DRC are your friends. Note that DRC design rule check does more then check the board, it has values that effect the layout itself.

The DRC restring value determines the size of pads on vias as a percentage of the drill size. The default value is 25%. I bump them up to 35% and even 45% if possible to make soldering easier and the pads better able to stand up to rework. Some parts have the pins close together and will limit how large a value you can use for restring.



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