Contraversial Issue:Religion vs. Science

[Souper man]

What do you believe in?

Science or Religion.

Please do not put down other ideas, but you can provide your own "Ideas".

I believe in Science.

Please if you read this just put down either science or religion. I just want to know who out there believes in what.

 

[Glyph]

Usually a topic like this degenerates into a flame war.

 

[AllVol]

Why must it be one or the other?

 

[Leftyretro]

Why must it be one or the other?

Agreed, must they be mutually exclusive? Or just better for chat trolling

 

[Sceadwian]

Exactly what I would have said AllVol.

Personally I tend towards a zen approach to life in general, and adore most physical sciences because of it. I abhor organized religion excluding one major aspect of it, that of community, and the helping of individuals. While I hate the fundamental aspects of almost all religions they do work for people in helping to structure their lives in a productive sense, I find that more of a boon to society than the other tenants of organized religion, that of basically brain washing into doctrine and feeding of information rather than teaching how to learn and understand the universe around us the best we can without other minds clouding our own judgment. I'm also a hardcore solipsist philosophically speaking though which makes it very difficult to talk to me about such fundamentally conscious abstracts. They just don't translate. Basically everything we know of the world starts and stops with self. Organized religions doesn't teach self, they teach group. While good for society as a whole it stifles conscious self discovery under a haze of 'that is just the way it is' rhetoric.

That is however MY opinion. I don't discourage anyone from their own way of thinking or atempt to make this statement for ANY other purpose other than attempting to explain at least a microcosm of what I think, which can not change what anyone else believes, neither should it be read as a condemnation of any other belief system or religious protocol from any belief system of any kind. =)

Hopefully that'll fend off a few flames!

 

[kchriste]

I believe in Science.

Science is not a matter of "belief" or "faith".....
I do "trust" in the scientific method and in the repeatability of experiments.
Put me down for Science then.

 

[Hero999]

Scientology.

 

[t.o.]

I believe in God. Science sometimes is the way to explain God's act.

 

[Optikon]

Put me down for science also.
_Believeing_ and _Knowing_ are two very different things. Some take comfort in just believing thats fine for them - ignorance is bliss so they say. Others want to KNOW.

Religion is subject to
1) Interpretation
2) Brainwashing - ahem scientology and others
3) The errors of man - who wrote the bible? which version? why is some missing?
4) Too much selectivity - I believe this but not that and on and on.

Science falls victim to no such things. However science struggles to understand the nature of reality. This is a long, difficult task which may never be complete so there are gaps there too - what is one to do?

For the things that science cannot explain though, people do have to make up their minds about what they believe. So in a sense, everyone is religious to some extent.

 

[Sceadwian]

Optikon, the problem with every point you brought up against religion is it is also present in science... In the 'pure' world of science there is no such thing as knowledge or truth or fact, only theories. Every day these theories are upgraded and changed eventually to the point where the original posit is eventually shown to be irrelevant. Knowledge in the end is a fools goal, it is learning that's important.

 

[AllVol]

Interesting discussion so far, much like most theological debates at the seminaries.

However, do not lose sight of the difference between RELIGION and SPIRITUALITY.

Religion is made by man, for man to serve man's own interests.

Spirituality is on a much higher plane, and demonstrates the connection between each individual and his innermost concept of his reason for existance.

Some of us have a true feeling of connectivity with a higher power, while others see self at the center of the universe. Unfortunately, the answer can only be found when the final curtain rings down.

"As for me and my house, we shall serve the Lord."

 

[Gayan Soyza]

If you ask from a Priest he will tell he believes in GOD.
If you ask from an Engineer he will tell he believes science.

Personally I believe in both Science and Religion.

God is my shepherd and science is the Sheep.

 

[mvs sarma]

Hi all,
great scientists have turned philisophers later.

While religion gives you an oppertunity for a well disciplined life style, science will elevate your abilities to live and contribute to the society.
Science without religion backgroud and religion alone without some technical backgroud-- will make person incomplete-- At the same time there are Great people in both religeous and scientific l walks of life.

having said that, we , i believe , need not segregate the two sides of a coin which will help better society

Hope many will agree with the type of thinking.

Regards
Sarma

 

[3v0]

I put this to a local minister.

Given the vastness of the universe do you think it is possible that God created intelligent life on other planets? He said yes.

It it possible that God created man's soul in his image, rather then the physical body? He said yes.

Given that the above two are possible, it is also possible that aliens from other planets may look vastly different from us, perhaps slugs, and still be children of God? He said yes.

Would you be willing to repeat this next Sunday in your service.
He said no.

Science is a bit like that too. Correct thinking will be ignored if not popular. Dark matter comes to mind.

I used to think that the only problem with religion was man. The same applies to science.

 

[Optikon]

I used to think that the only problem with religion was man. The same applies to science.

But not as much so. With science there are usually things to contend with that do not involve man (arguable data etc..)

With religion, pretty much everything to contend with is man-made.

 

[theinfamousbob]

I believe in God. Science sometimes is the way to explain God's act.

I'm going to expand on this, based on what I've come to believe...

Science is perfectly valid; however, it is also a test of faith. Sure God did everything else, gave us something to believe in that is true and make it look like the universe just happened on its own. Personally, an hour at church every week isn't bad at all; plenty of life lessons can be learned.

Religion doesn't have to conflict with science. It's not a problem to believe in both or neither. The only question is, if there is an afterlife, as a non-religious person, are you willing to accept your choice? If there isn't, will we ever really know?

 

[ThermalRunaway]

I can only "believe" in what I can see, or what can be proved by experiment. So, with that in mind I can't say that I believe in God. That doesn't mean I deny any possibility that he (or she) might exist, only that there is no evidence to support it at the moment and until some comes to light, I'm sticking with Science!!

Brian

 

[TekNoir]

Here are a few quotes from Albert Einstein that sums up my feelings...

When asked by an astounded atheist, if he were in fact deeply religious, Einstein replied:

Yes, you can call it that. Try and penetrate with our limited means the secrets of nature and you will find that, behind all the discernible concatenations, there remains something subtle, intangible and inexplicable. Veneration for this force beyond anything that we can comprehend is my religion. To that extent I am, in point of fact, religious.

— H. G. Kessler, The Diary of a Cosmopolitan, (London: Weidenfeld and Nicolson, 1971), p.157; quoted in Einstein and Religion by Max Jammer (Princeton University Press, 1999) pp. 39-40.

Everyone who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe - a spirit vastly superior to that of man.... In this way the pursuit of science leads to a religious feeling of a special sort, which is indeed quite different from the religiosity of someone more naive.

— Letter to a child who asked if scientists pray, January 24, 1936; Einstein Archive 42-601

My feeling is religious insofar as I am imbued with tile consciousness of the insufficiency of the human mind to understand more deeply the harmony of the Universe which we try to formulate as "laws of nature."

— Letter to Beatrice Frohlich, December 17, 1952; Einstein Archive 59-797

As my life progresses, I have become far more "religious," or what I refer to as spiritual, due to my studies in mathematics and science and not in spite of these studies.

Coincidentally, I am not an advocate of organized religion whatsoever. The "we're right and everyone else is wrong" mentality of most organized religions is against my personal beliefs about what is possibly right in this existence. There is a daily ongoing battle against racial bigotry. It is a shame that we cannot stamp out religious bigotry as well.

---- ----

By the way and for those whom are interested, here is a link to more quotes by Albert Einstein on the subjects of science and religion.

https://www.einsteinandreligion.com/

 

[Hank Fletcher]

I don't really think of myself as a religious or scientific type. Can any of you explain this equation to me?

Clapton = God

 

[HarveyH42]

I think religion in the proper context is a good thing. It is more or less the foundation of modern society. Unfortunately, it's grown beyond it's origional intent, and I think its mostly used, and used badly. The bible is a guide book, not rules or laws. Church is about the people, not money, property, or buildings. I tend to believe that God was a great inventor, and did create all that we see, but I don't believe that he continues to influence or change any of this, has since moved on to bigger and better projects. He gave use everything we needed, and left it up to us to make into heaven or hell, kind of the point in this experiment. Too many people use religion as a crutch, god 'will fix it', or why bother, the end is coming...

Science is great, but too many people confuse facts and theory. Facts are the repeatable things, theorys are the observations and guess as to why (not always accurate or true, mostly opinion). Certain things consider laws, are therories, and likely are missing a few things, or some variables omit as usually not important, but later may be found to be useful.

I think that when either science or religion is taken too literally or seriously, there problems. One of the biggest cause of arguements and wars. It's best to keep an open mind. Maybe I have trouble taking anything on faith, I tend to challenge anything I'm told can not be changed. Seems that is how great things are born.