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Brushless DC Motor

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Clyd3

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I'm making a brushless DC motor for a flying thing.
The nice thing is, whatever I want machined, I can get machined for free.
So far, all I know is that I can get the casing made out of titanium, which is nice, 'cause its light... and stuff... yeah!
What I need to know right now is:
1 ... General design guidelines / considerations
2 ... What wire I will use for the windings

All help will help... I want to make it as professionally as possible...
 
make sure you use laminated the stator to minimise the induced currents.

how big a machine are you doing? I am used to using lamiated bars that are stacked into the stator slots and terminated at teh end-windings.

I am guessing a low-power rating, use enameled wire to ensure the slot packing is as high as possible. THe gauge of the wire... well you will need to do some calc on how many amp-turns you going to need

How are you going to fix the magnets to the rotor?
 
I'm not sure what I'll stick em with, what do you think I should use?
What I really want to know now is: What kind of metals I can / should I use for the windings. I can enamel my own wires, but would it benefit me to use a more conductive wire, such as silver or not?
It will be pretty easy for me to get the right size silver, just time consuming to enamel it i guess...
is there more to it?
 
hey styx, any technical documentation i should look into?
esp. on the net???
all is useful...
I need to know more, obviously, if I want to make these good enough...
 
Well, been doin some searching, and found a few interesting things, and I found books I wouldnt mind buying etc, but I have to say that I will be investigating how to stick those magnets. At least when it comes to glues etc. I can find awesome stuff... (and abrasives too - why am I telling you this)
Looks like this'll end up quite good...
anyway, the book I found is :
Design of Brushless Permanent-Magnet Motors
and I've still got to work on calculations etc. keep you posted...

https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/...45412?_encoding=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&v=glance
 
aw common!!!
will someone give me a hand, please???
I want to know whether or not silver would be better for the purpose of windings in a motor esp. brushless dc, and what the best possible wire for the job is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
use copper, if weight a problem use Aluminium
 
Clyd3 said:
I want to know whether or not silver would be better for the purpose of windings in a motor esp. brushless dc, and what the best possible wire for the job is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just use copper. It's not hard to limit the resistive losses of the wire, it's not a really big issue. The performance limitations come from the magnetic properties of the core.

Lots of performance motors out there, and I never heard of anyone trying to use silver.

Now you mention a "flying thingy". I just wanted to check on your expectations here. If you want to learn how motors are built, you'll have fun. If you think you're going to make something better/lighter than you can buy, like you want to make something with a better power-to-weight ratio for a "flying thingy", you're going to be sorely dissappointed. Realistically the best you can make by hand with available materials will only by a tiny fraction of the performance you can get off anything manufactured, in terms of power output, size, power-to-weight ratio, efficiency, etc.

Anything to keep you from wanting to "play with mercury" is a good thing.
 
that's true, I'm still trying to resist playing with mercury.
The reason I want to try and use silver, is because I have *SUFFICIENT QUANTITIES* of the stuff lying around... it's not hard to imagine a pile of treasure!!!
So conductivity and weight were the two factors influencing it seems. I thought we would be choosing based on something to do with flux or something, which is, in a way, why I first though of using silver <for arguments sake, to find out that, yeah>
I am making the *flying thing* because it looks like fun, and considering the manufacturing tools I have at my command; toolmakers, jewellers, professional manufacturers etc., it shouldnt be too inefficient. In fact, considering the time it does take to make what I want to make, I have a huge advantage over other hobbiests. If I send an accurate drawing through, and supply certain materials <the silver>, the project will never take long. Also, if I did know exactly what materials and formulas to use, I would most certainly be able to rival some easily available motors.
That is not my goal!
My goal is to have a bit of experience in making stuff, yeah... I enjoy being able to see exactly how much less effective my versions are and why. It is a good learning method too, and I bet, someone wanted to say wasteful, but hey, from my perspective, many people in other countries waste many things I wouldnt...
So, I figure that, my difficulty in finding electronic components is, without question, directly opposite to the capabilities I have of getting anything I want made, made. My <family members> are fanatical inventor / designers, and have made <money> by doing so. Not to mention contacts.

I'd like to say in closing that I am not going to make slightly or apparently unrealistic statements like many say roboticinfo said, but I will say that I work part time at Nasa, and part time at my job, as a student of Northwood High School, Durban, South Arrica...gr.11,age:17...

<so, anyone have more technical info for me to play with????>
< i am gonna do stats with aluminium copper and silver, and some more
conductive light weight alloys and give you the results in quite a while, but first I need some formulas to know how many turns to have, what size gives what power or whatever... I'm not mathematically challenged...>
by the way, thanks everyone, I really enjoy this place, always getting answers I dont expect...
 
Clyd3 said:
The reason I want to try and use silver, is because I have *SUFFICIENT QUANTITIES* of the stuff lying around... it's not hard to imagine a pile of treasure!!!

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:


well, errr, um,... you might as well use silver then.
The reason Gold and Silver are not used is the cost, but if you happened to be in posession of significant quantities might as well use it.

All I can say it using silver will be alot easier then copper (maluable) and that will be key in getting the packing of the slots high.
A factor that will determine that will be the insulation you use around the silver and this in turn is determined by operating voltages.

Have you thought abt bearings? what is the maximum speed this machine to rotate at. The speed of rotation will also influence what is used to fix the magnets onto the rotor since these could come off.

What are you using for position sensing and bearing in mind that the end-winding are going to emit alot of (concentrated) field and also a point of high temperature?
 
well, firstly, bearings are about the only thing that I'm not completely worried about. Secondly, silver is waaaaaaaaaay easier to use than copper, is way more malleable, and can be made a lot thinner. It can be coated very well, if prepared and polished well (does so pretty well in the wire making process), <I did a bit of jewellery work while at nasa...>

There is a something i'm interested in, which I got a samle of, it was a glueish stuff made by these people who made contact type glue, I'll forward you the reply from them when I get it... quite nice...

What I dont know enough of is what you said about position sensing, but I guess I understand a little.

I also want to know more about the points of high temperature and I desperately need some mathematical means of calculations for the wirings and magnets etc. At least basic stuff, but I'm looking, give me hints if you can... thanks...

by the way, I also wanted to see, by your comments, how much of a difference it would make, 'cause I could always make jewellery for a girlfriend or something... that's sweet...
 
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