A question about Transformers

[Chumly]

There's even a film about it, which is quite interesting.

I would be thrilled if you could locate that as per YouTube or otherwise. In fact any videos on the pioneers of power distribution / power generation would be great!

Much thanks!

 

[ericgibbs]

Fair enough, do you thus think the definition of comeback and the subsequent viewpoint to be incorrect?

In any case, and outside of the silliness at hand, if you have any info in regard to the topic at hand, I would be more than pleased to read it and respond in kind.

hi,
There is no silliness or confrontational intent.

But with ref to Mag Amps you are pushing on an open door.! I agree with you.
I cant say it any plainer than that.

My usage of 'comeback' is that 'something' that has gone out of fashion/use and is now coming back into use, as you have stated the Mag Amp is still in service, so how can something make a comeback if it hasn't gone out of usage.

 

[ericgibbs]

I would be thrilled if you could locate that as per YouTube or otherwise. In fact any videos on the pioneers of power distribution / power generation would be great!

Much thanks!

hi,
I also saw that TV documentary.

 

[Chumly]

......so how can something make a comeback if it hasn't gone out of usage.

Ah....because I use the word in the relative sense and not the absolute sense, as such my text indicates this context.

I can't be responsible should you wish to apply the word outside the context of my text! Well I could take said responsibility but I won't (insert punchline).

I'm off the Costco to buy some stuff......

 

[Larry4911]

Not really true - there was an ongoing battle between Edison and Westinghouse - one DC and one AC. Both were trying to prove the others system was the most dangerous - including various barbaric displays in the streets. The invention of the electric chair was just another stunt to try and discredit the rivel system.

There's even a film about it, which is quite interesting.

That's what I said, basically.

Larry

 

[Larry4911]

I would just like to point out that I do know what I'm talking about. I studied under the 15th edition of the regs. I maybe a bit rusty but who isn't after 20 odd years.

Also, do you know who it was that wrote to the IEE and pointed out that all electrical and electronic suppliers and manufacturers', in the UK at the time, where in fact in breach of the regulations. In that the regs stated that the manufacturer's plate on any electrical or electronic device must state the true RMS value of the required supply voltage.

Go on. Guess.

Larry

 

[Hero999]

Not so! In one major way DC is more difficult to work with.

Given the same heating effect when making the comparison, and given the same volts and amps when making the comparison, the DC arc will be herder to quench than the AC arc. Thus the switch gear and arc suppression must be more robust for the equivalent DC system.

Why you might ask? Because DC is steady state yet AC falls to zero twice per cycle.

That's true although an arc will form at 70.7% of the DC voltage with AC because the peak voltage is 1.414 times higher.

 

[rezer]

Sorry guys but that's dog pucky! All things being equal in that we are talking about the same voltages and currents vis-à-vis RMS equivalence, then AC has more transmission losses than DC. Clearly you guys have never heard of AC Effective Resistance.

And in any case it's current not voltage that is often the higher function of specific losses due to I squared Z.

Sorry Chumly but DC transmission loss is greater than AC. If what you say is true, Edison would have won his spout with Westinghouse. But that didn't happen because of the poor transmission efficiency of DC. Heavier cables were needed, as well as more stations to boost the power back up to exceptable levels (about every mile). ACs effieciency is far superior to DC. That's why it is used.

 

[Chumly]

Sorry Chumly but DC transmission loss is greater than AC. If what you say is true, Edison would have won his spout with Westinghouse. But that didn't happen because of the poor transmission efficiency of DC. Heavier cables were needed, as well as more stations to boost the power back up to exceptable levels (about every mile). ACs effieciency is far superior to DC. That's why it is used.

Sadly you are sorely confused on a number of issues, some of which are:

Edison so-called "lost" because (among other reasons) DC (at that time) could not be stepped up and down easily, and DC machines were more complex and expensive than AC machines.

You are way off track when you talk about AC being more "efficient" than DC, neither is the case per se, it's application specific.

Total nonsense as per "heavier cables", wire size is a function of ampacity and the insulation's thermal rating.

You do not understand AC Effective Resistance as it pertains to line loss.

 

[rezer]

Chumly,

I agree that AC is easier to step-up/down than DC. I never disputed that. I agree that it is the primary advantage.

As far as the rest of the points you made...I have some research to do.

 

[ericgibbs]

Ah....because I use the word in the relative sense and not the absolute sense, as such my text indicates this context.

I can't be responsible should you wish to apply the word outside the context of my text! Well I could take said responsibility but I won't (insert punchline).

My Waffle Ommeter has just gone off the scale.!

 

[Torben]

My Waffle Ommeter has just gone off the scale.!

Morning Eric!

I have to agree with you. As I understand it (and this is just from what I've read), magnetic amplifiers are still around, but semiconductor amps have taken over for most uses just because they are smaller and cheaper. If magnetic amps can be made smaller and cheaper than transistor amps then of course they will step into the limelight, but the issue has swayed from that point (and it doesn't seem an immediate concern).

As for the defense of semantics: https://xkcd.com/169/


Torben

 

[Claude Abraham]

How wrong you are! In fact magnetic amplifiers might make a comeback and magnetism itself is far from being fully understood.

"The magnetic amplifier is important to many phases of naval engineering because it provides a rugged, trouble-free device that has many applications aboard ship and in aircraft. These applications include throttle controls on the main engines of ships; speed, frequency, voltage, current, and temperature controls on auxiliary equipment; and fire control, servomechanisms, and stabilizers for guns, radar, and sonar equipment."

**broken link removed**

You are way off topic. My statement was simply that transformers were examined long ago, and the benefits of AC over DC, the transmission at high voltage etc. is well known. I didn't say that magnetics in general is finished. Don't read things into my statements. Mag amplifiers are not even under discussion. Do you look for reasons to rebuke others? If I say anything that can be taken out of context and twisted, you're right there to correct me in front of everyone. This thread was moving smoothly and you jump in and start a rutkus by raising an issue not even relevant to the OP question. BR.

 

[rezer]

You are way off topic. My statement was simply that transformers were examined long ago, and the benefits of AC over DC, the transmission at high voltage etc. is well known. I didn't say that magnetics in general is finished. Don't read things into my statements. Mag amplifiers are not even under discussion. Do you look for reasons to rebuke others? If I say anything that can be taken out of context and twisted, you're right there to correct me in front of everyone. This thread was moving smoothly and you jump in and start a rutkus by raising an issue not even relevant to the OP question. BR.

Well put Claude.

Chumly,

Stay on track with the discussion at hand and stop arguing semantics. If I am wrong, and on occasion I may be, it's fine to dispute that, but don't twist words to cause discourse.