Where can I find the complete circuit diagram for PIC pgrogrammer?

[thecritic]

You may have damaged your parallel port. They are not designed to light an LED.

Mike.

oh! really? How much mA can they provide?

 

[thecritic]

O.K, to check the programmer if it is wired properly, I supplied 13 volts to the programmer (no other connection made, and the PIC not placed in the slot). It drained 45mA. The 7805 gets fairly warm. Both the Red and green led is glowing. Is this normal? Can i proceed to connect the parallel port and then program?


https://www.oshonsoft.com/picproghard.png
(I have used the direct 13.2 Volt Dc, so I have avoided the 7812 part of the circuit)

 

[Wp100]

Hi,

At 45ma thats way too high - you have a partial short somewhere -switch off.

If you see the bottom of page 2 of that pdf I posted it shows typical currents at various stages, which your programmer should similarly follow.

How have you constructed it, a pcb or strip board or breadboard.. ?

 

[thecritic]

Hi,

At 45ma thats way too high - you have a partial short somewhere -switch off.

If you see the bottom of page 2 of that pdf I posted it shows typical currents at various stages, which your programmer should similarly follow.

How have you constructed it, a pcb or strip board or breadboard.. ?

Thanks for the reply. After, little think-back, I came to conclusion that I hooked of the transistor with Emiter-Collector Swapped!
Do you think this is the reason for the malfunction?

 

[thecritic]

uf! Even after correcting the transistors, Both Led Glows and the circuit draws 46 mA at 13 Volts!
[If it had drawn 10 A, then fine, I could conclude there is a short, but this 46mA is driving me crazy!)

 

[Jon Chandler]

....to try to get the stupids things to work...no matter how much it actually costs or how long it actually takes.

Maybe, just maybe, the people recommending the PICkits have learned from their mistakes along the way.

I rest my case.

 

[thecritic]

I rest my case.

I didn't quite get what you meant to say, but reading your quoted text, I think you want to tell me --"See that, I already told you those stupid things don't work! and Now you are stuck!!! Thats the penalty for not doing what I told."
Haha, lol.
You are still proving your ego, instead of helping me build (which is the sole purpose of this thread.) Thats amazing!

 

[Wp100]

Hi,

Was out after my last post so only just seen your photos.

You have used a 7805 instead of the much lower current 78L05 which may account for most of the 45ma.

Best way to check this is to disconnect the 7805 output , connect the power and measure the current being taken by just the 7805 then add the 18ma that the transistors and ic should take - does that equal 45ma - if so then it seems there is no short.

Getting the transistor pin outs wrong is an easy mistake, not all manufacturers use the same pinout for the same transistors, so you must check them carefully.


The other thing that caught my eye from your photo was what seems to be the parallel data leads, they are just plain wires - perhaps they go to a proper parallel lead - its important you use a good quality paralllel lead if your connection is more than a foot away, otherwise the signals can be lost.

 

[thecritic]

Hi,

Was out after my last post so only just seen your photos.

You have used a 7805 instead of the much lower current 78L05 which may account for most of the 45ma.

Best way to check this is to disconnect the 7805 output , connect the power and measure the current being taken by just the 7805 then add the 18ma that the transistors and ic should take - does that equal 45ma - if so then it seems there is no short.

Getting the transistor pin outs wrong is an easy mistake, not all manufacturers use the same pinout for the same transistors, so you must check them carefully.


The other thing that caught my eye from your photo was what seems to be the parallel data leads, they are just plain wires - perhaps they go to a proper parallel lead - its important you use a good quality paralllel lead if your connection is more than a foot away, otherwise the signals can be lost.

I tested 7805 in isolation, by connecting a LED (with series Resistance) in the output and applying 13V to input. the Led consumed 6.5 mA at 5 volts and 7805 consumed 9.8mA at 13Volts.

Since, in the programmer, only two leds are glowing, one of which glows directly from 13V supply, I still can't get the 45mA.
(I have the inputs opens (since I haven't connected the programmer to the computer), can this be the reason for higher wattage. I have hear leaving inputs floating in some ICs are disastrous to power consumption.)

For the cable, O.K, I will replace it with this Serial cable, Cut one side and attach the parallel jack.
**broken link removed**

 

[Jon Chandler]

Actually, what I said was that usually, trying to built a programmer wasn't worth the effort and frustration, and that a PICkit 2 would probably be cheaper in the long run. Many people who try and build these give up in frustration.

After bread-boarding your programmer and 5 pages of help from forum members, you still don't have anything that works. And a lot of people have given up their time to try and help.

If your goal is to spend time debugging a programmer, more power to you. IF your goal is to actually work with PICs and program them, you're not making much progress.

I shared with you my experience that these programmers are a pain in the butt. You said I didn't know what I'm talking about. Remember, nobody here OWES you any help and assistance. You might benefit from good advice or not.

 

[Wp100]

Hi,

As you can see from those current figures I did the ic only takes about 4ma.

Your regulator current sounds ok, so you need to isolate whatever is taking the extra power, disconnect the + connection to the ic ( better to use an ic socket so you can easily unplug it ) and see what the current is then.

If that only drops the 45ma by 4-5ma then seems like you have problems with the transistors or wiring.

 

[thecritic]

Actually, what I said was that usually, trying to built a programmer wasn't worth the effort and frustration, and that a PICkit 2 would probably be cheaper in the long run. Many people who try and build these give up in frustration.
After bread-boarding your programmer and 5 pages of help from forum members, you still don't have anything that works. And a lot of people have given up their time to try and help.
If your goal is to spend time debugging a programmer, more power to you. IF your goal is to actually work with PICs and program them, you're not making much progress.
I shared with you my experience that these programmers are a pain in the butt. You said I didn't know what I'm talking about. Remember, nobody here OWES you any help and assistance. You might benefit from good advice or not.

I have never taken your advice in the negative sense. I understand that you have done best to help me avoid the frustration and useless effort you have already gone through. Thanks. But as I already told, I want to go the hard way (actually I need to). I hope you will understand that.

 

[thecritic]

Hi,

As you can see from those current figures I did the ic only takes about 4ma.

Your regulator current sounds ok, so you need to isolate whatever is taking the extra power, disconnect the + connection to the ic ( better to use an ic socket so you can easily unplug it ) and see what the current is then.

If that only drops the 45ma by 4-5ma then seems like you have problems with the transistors or wiring.

O.K. I did like that and I concluded the 7406 was already damaged (my be due to excessive soldering heat or may be due to static (or dynamic, I don know) of the un-grounded soldering Iron)
I de-soldered it, and checked it in bread-board. yes it was damaged and it was consuming much of the 45mA
I re-soldered another hex inverter (but 4069 CMOS, inverter).
Yeah now the programmer is drawing 9mA at 13 Volts. Thats fine I think. (the leds are glowing).

But, I am afraid if the CMOS replacement of the TTL Inverter will do me any harm?

 

[thecritic]

Also, What things should I be checking, before I join the programmer to the parallel port and then before I hook up the PIC into the programmer.

 

[Wp100]

Hi,

Well the circuit is built around Open Collector TTL Inverter chips.

Would a Cmos 4069 work ..? well really not sure there are many parameters to consider like Fan out etc - also that parallel circuits have been around for years - if you could use a 4069 instead of the 74s then I would have thought someone would have mentioned it before now.

Sure another more knowledgeable member can answer that point better than me.

If the currents now seem ok , then all you can do it try the software and see if it communicates with the pic chip.

One of the problems with a circuit like that is that when one part is damaged the other active parts can also fail and the same time or soon after, if you find one defective part then is perhaps wise to replace the tansistors and ic together.
When using the correct L type of regulators (100ma max load) its often worthwhile replacing those as well but with your 1A 7805 the small short is unlikey to have affected it.

 

[ericgibbs]

The problem was with the PC. I switched to another old PC, it worked there (the led glowed). But I don't know, if its the issue with the OS (both Xp), or the parallel port itself.

hi
Do you have the 'input32.dll' in your Windows/System32 folder.? its required for Win XP.

 

[thecritic]

hi
Do you have the 'input32.dll' in your Windows/System32 folder.? its required for Win XP.

Yes it does. I think, the parallel port is already damaged (my be by my elders who had already experimented on it. )
What do you think of the CMOS replacement?

 

[ericgibbs]

Yes it does. I think, the parallel port is already damaged (my be by my elders who had already experimented on it. )
What do you think of the CMOS replacement?

Problem is with a CD4069 its NOT an open output, its got an active pull up, you would have two active outputs connected together which is a bad idea.

 

[thecritic]

Problem is with a CD4069 its NOT an open output, its got an active pull up, you would have two active outputs connected together which is a bad idea.

Could you please explain to me which two active outputs would be connected together? Of the PIC and the 4069?

 

[Wp100]

Hi,

Just get a few 74ls06 or 7406 chips and keep your circuit true to the original design, as already mentioned these programmers, built as specified, can be tempremental at times

Trying to change to a different type of chip before you have even got the circuit working is a route to just more trouble.
If it was such a simple thing to do then we would say so.