interlocking switch

[Adrian116]

Well, it's also hard to know how to approach it without being sure about the remote control itself...


An eclipse? Solar or lunar? I'd love a good solar eclipse. Lunars are cool too but I haven't stood in a good solar eclipse since I was too young to understand what was happening. Either way I wish I could be in China on Friday to see it (and I've always wanted to go to China).


Torben

What kind of information you want? I try my best to figure it out~

This is a Solar eclipse~ I will watch it surely~^^
I have never seen this before~

 

[Mikebits]

Wow, it is even on Wiki.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_eclipse_of_August_1,_2008

 

[Torben]

What kind of information you want? I try my best to figure it out~

OK, what I'd really like to know is what the lines are you were going to connect to in the remote control. I assume that you have it apart, and were just going to solder wires straight to the traces leading to the switch contacts?

Do you know what voltages those lines have on them? For example, when you press the button, does a +V line connect to ground?

Do you have any photos of the opened remote control, showing the circuit clearly?

This is a Solar eclipse~ I will watch it surely~^^
I have never seen this before~

I hope that the weather is good for it. See if you can borrow some welding goggles or a welding mask from someone. It should be beautiful.


Torben

 

[Mikebits]

I would assume active low, but then again I wonder if some use that row column scan method. Been awhile since I have looked at a remote.

 

[Torben]

I would assume active low, but then again I wonder if some use that row column scan method. Been awhile since I have looked at a remote.

I'm also guessing active low, but it's hard to say for sure.

Now that I come to think of it, San Diego is also a beautiful place to visit. Jade plants as big as trees, great weather, etc.


Torben

 

[Mikebits]

I'm also guessing active low, but it's hard to say for sure.

Now that I come to think of it, San Diego is also a beautiful place to visit. Jade plants as big as trees, great weather, etc.

Torben

Yeah it is real nice here, never gets too cold, sometime a little hot but not too often. If you ever get down this way, I would be happy to show you the sights. If your into nature, check out my San Diego geology website. The link is in my profile. I don't want to seem like I am advertising so I won't post the link.

Geology is my passion of late, more so than electronics.

 

[Adrian116]

OK, what I'd really like to know is what the lines are you were going to connect to in the remote control. I assume that you have it apart, and were just going to solder wires straight to the traces leading to the switch contacts?

Do you know what voltages those lines have on them? For example, when you press the button, does a +V line connect to ground?


Torben

I have just simply connected the relay NO to the switch of the remote control directly. I have used multimeter to check that +V voltage is across the switch.

The remote control is not in my hand now.......

 

[Mikebits]

I have just simply connected the relay NO to the switch of the remote control directly. I have used multimeter to check that +V voltage is across the switch.

The remote control is not in my hand now.......

What Torben was asking was as follows:

Put black lead of meter to - terminal of remote battery. Now put red lead to one side of switch on remote. This may be hard as many remotes just fall to peices when you take them apart. Anyways If you manage to get your lead on the switch look for one side that reads something like battery voltage. 3V maybe. Then press the switch and observe the meter, the volts should go to zero. What you are looking for is one side of the switch that changes condition from +volt to 0 volt or vice versa. May take some time to get all your hands in the right place, a helper would make it easier.

Did that make sense?

 

[Adrian116]

What Torben was asking was as follows:

Put black lead of meter to - terminal of remote battery. Now put red lead to one side of switch on remote. This may be hard as many remotes just fall to peices when you take them apart. Anyways If you manage to get your lead on the switch look for one side that reads something like battery voltage. 3V maybe. Then press the switch and observe the meter, the volts should go to zero. What you are looking for is one side of the switch that changes condition from +volt to 0 volt or vice versa. May take some time to get all your hands in the right place, a helper would make it easier.

Did that make sense?

I see what you mean. But I am sorry that i don't have the remote control now.........I will tell you as soon as possible~

 

[Mikebits]

I see what you mean. But I am sorry that i don't have the remote control now.........I will tell you as soon as possible~

If you really want to do this, the info Torben wants would be really helpful as using transistors or such would be much cheaper than expensive relays. Make it your priority

 

[Torben]

Thanks for clarifying that Mike! I had to head to bed. . .


Torben

 

[john1]

Hi,

I am putting forward this skeleton diagram, not as an answer but as a possibility.
As can be seen, there is no resistor in series with the cap,
thats ok on a small dry cell battery run unit, the cap wouldn't be large anyway.
It wouldn't be ok on a larger re-chargeable battery unit,
which is why i asked if the intended relay and switch box was meant to use the
same battery or one of its own.

Mikebits,
previously i mentioned using an arrangement where a cap or caps would charge,
then would only use leakage current.
Rather than using a cap to close a relay using its charging current.
Although the difference to the relay may be insignificant, it requires an extra
resistor, which unfortunately has to remain in circuit.

Using a cap or caps from a charged condition means that (for this) the discharge
into the relay coil determines how long the relay operates. The cap would be
chosen to give the period required.
Just as you have already shown in your diagram, but round the other way.

You have put 1 Mfd caps, i would have guessed at around five or six.

The advantage to doing it like this would be to minimise battery current.

(also i am fiddling about, trying to see if the posts will support an image,
i dont think they will, but i'll have a go)

Regards, John

 

[john1]

well maybe they will.

 

[Adrian116]

Hey guys, i am so sorry that to leave msg so late.......

I can't get the remote now since the customer is testing it.

May be you guys enjoys your weekend first~

Thank all of you so much~

 

[john1]

Hi Adrian,

I've posted another picture.
Same arrangement, just filled in a few bits.
This should use no battery current, except capacitor leakage, which is almost
shelf-life for most batteries.

Until its used, then its just LED current until its switched off again,
then a little to recharge.

I think its battery should cover a month, or more.

****************

I shall try to have a nice weekend, i am attemping to put together a solar collector,
just to warm water a bit to reduce my bills.
The gas company which is selling gas to British consumers, (not petrol, but gas which
is the consistency of air) has just put their prices up by "35 per cent" which is
actually more than forty per cent to most of us.

They call themselves 'British Gas' but they are owned and run from abroad by unknown
groups, for profit. And a jolly good profit they make too. Last year, Two thousand
million pounds sterling. Very nice.
Not so nice here, in the cold.

****************

Apart from that, i am really quite happy.

John

*************

 

[john1]

Just noticed a problem with my submission.
I dont think the toggle type switches have a connection in the middle position.

So, unless anyone knows of a type that do have a connection in the middle,
then that arrangement i posted wont work.

Or the OP could consider a rotary type.

Meanwhile i will have a little think, in case theres a way to do it without a
connection on the middle position.

( yes i know i can remove the posts, but i just dont care. )

And i did get a little heat from my solar collector, made out of an old
radiator painted black. Haven't piped it in, still experimenting.

Cheers, John

 

[KMoffett]

I still think a µcontroller, with Mosfet's switching his "remote control " is the best "low power" solution. But since I was playing with relay switching in another thread I came up with this "all in my head" circuit...no bench testing...therefore no component values. The second set of contacts on the relay quickly discharge the opposite relay's capacitor, more rapidly extinguishing its LED at switch-over. Led current and capacitor leakage are the continuous load on the battery.

Ken

Thought I should add my first concept too....the second image.

 

[Mikebits]

I still think a µcontroller, with Mosfet's switching his "remote control "

I think your right, but the OP may not have any experience with such things as writing code. Then again, I could be wrong as that happens a lot

 

[john1]

Hi Ken,

Thanks for adding your relay based idea possibilities.
If the OP has only limited electronic experience, very often relays are a practical solution.
working with integrated circuits is all very well, but relays can often be much simpler.

Ken, i have looked at your circuits closely, and they are (of course) correct in their
operation.
They use standard type relays with c/o type contacts.

I was thinking of reed-relays because of their low power requirements,
however, the relays would only be operated a brief period, so maybe standard types are Ok.

Plus with standard types, one can see the operation of the unit, which can be important to
the person making the unit.

I rather like the added contacts on each opposite capacitor, because:

Without them, if the user goes from one position to the other, a couple of times before
leaving it in the position he intends to leave it, then the cap could retain enough charge
during switching to malfuntion.
However the inclusion of these extra contacts ensures that the cap is discharged each time
the switch goes to a choice.

This was something which had me going, namely repeated or accidental switching by the user,
which with one of my earlier circuits would be a problem, so i did not include it.

I dont see from your post which of the circuits is the one you recommend, i assume its the
one with the extra contacts.

I can see no improvement to this circuit, other that simply using a single resistor for
the LEDs, which is hardly worth mentioning.

In fact, i think you have nailed it with that circuit.

Regards, John

 

[KMoffett]

John1,

Another iteration.

In order to use the smallest capacitors possible for the delay, you need relays with the hightest coil resistance for the given battery voltage. This implies miniture relays. This also means relays with low contact current ratings. Using small relay contacts to short out the capacitors would probably shorten their life. So, I just replaced the second set of relay contacts with a second set of contacts on the toggle switch. Might be even cheaper.

Ken

Because red and green LEDs have different light outputs and voltage drops for a given current, I chose two resistors to allow for optimization for lowest current on each.