I agree that there is no need that i can see to blank the display before updating it , did you see what it looked like without blanking it ?
maybe its worth a try?
nice tutorial
No, I've not tried it, I seriously doubt it makes any visible difference - but it was the 'nice' way to do itOriginally Posted by williB
PIC programmer software, and PIC Tutorials at:
http://www.winpicprog.co.uk
I agree. There is nothing wrong with your design considering the scope of your tutorial. My Charlieplexed display experiments showed you could get 'decent' brightness by directly driving the displays.Well, this has sparked some lively debate!
As for LED brightness, the scrolling numbers tutorial is clearly visible across the full length of the workshop - about 40 feet.
But I did discover a significant increase in brightness by simply adding a column or row driver transistor (which ever way you're scanning) and thought I'd pass along that observation.
The four transistors in the circuit below really make a big difference (sorry about the fuzzy picture).
Mike
<added>
I should also mention that there are some very low current (3-ma/segment) 7-segment displays from Fairchild and Agilent that provide very good brightness levels when directly driven in a multiplexed design. I wonder if there are "low current" discrete LEDs available for your 8x8 matrix?
Last edited by Mike, K8LH; 16th September 2006 at 10:37 AM.
I believe you're going to need "source" drivers for the LED anodes. The STP16C596 and the ULN2803A are both "sink" drivers.
If you can exchange your matrix displays for common anode versions then you could use the STP16C596 16-bit "sink" driver for the LED cathodes along with a UDN2981A "source" driver (instead of the ULN2803A) to drive the common anodes.
Mike
Quick update - I've added a short video clip of the scrolling display in action, about 20 seconds worth. Interestingly you get a nice interaction between the LED strobing and the camera, which gives a 'twinkling' effect to the LED's.
BTW, if anyone is interested?, I 'stole' the bit patterns from the Hitachi type LCD modules - I'm currently doing the letters as well.
PIC programmer software, and PIC Tutorials at:
http://www.winpicprog.co.uk
Nigel ya might as well link to it directly
i just saw it , its pretty cool !!
http://www.winpicprog.co.uk/video/led1.wmv
Mike
Unfortunatley I'am stuck with the cc matrix's.so my stp16c596 is no good what would you suggest use two 74hc595 in place of it and still use the 2803a?
Amen!Well, this has sparked some lively debate!
OK, I'll explain further.
My original plan was to use source and sink drivers in order to push more current through the LED's - and the original circuit I started drawing incorporated that - but I thought it was getting a little away from the 'simple' philosophy of the tutorials.
While doing mental calculations of suitable resistor values I realised it's quite plausible using just the PIC to drive the displays, so I dropped the drivers and increased the values of the current limiting resistors to 150 ohms.
Due to the modular nature of my tutorials, a further thought was to optionally add driver boards between the PIC and the display - I was thinking of two seperate boards, a 'sink' board and a 'source' board - both of which could also be used for other purposes (again reinforcing the modular nature of the boards).that does seem low. Are you certain the duty cycle for each row is 1/8 (minus a little for blanking during row change)? based on your numbers, it should be about double that. with some voltage drop from the pic, I'd expect more like 100-110 mA.BTW, I've just assembled a quick program that puts all the LED's ON, and measured the battery current - it was only 62mA? - which seems rather low?, but the LED's seem plenty bright enough. This was on my meter at work, I wonder is the current ranges aren't reading properly? - it very rarely gets used on current, I'll measure again with my meter at home.
Just measured it again, at home this time, still 62mA?.
Certainly the multiplexing was 1/8th the other day when I scoped it, I'll try it again and see what's going on!. Might not be till Monday now though.
PIC programmer software, and PIC Tutorials at:
http://www.winpicprog.co.uk
OK, I've added two more sections to the tutorial, the first adds full text capability, and the second uses that to scroll a text message across the display.
PIC programmer software, and PIC Tutorials at:
http://www.winpicprog.co.uk
OK, I've got the scope round it - with all 64 LED's lit, the PIC pins are only pulling the bottom of the LED's down to 1.65V above 0V, there's 1.75V dropped across the LED's, and 1.6V across the 150 ohm resistors. So this is about 10mA peak through the LED's.
As you say, adding sink drivers would easily increase that, but it's bright enough as it is.
PIC programmer software, and PIC Tutorials at:
http://www.winpicprog.co.uk
LED capacitor
I was just wondering how the multiplexing of the LED matrix would affect the system power supply? Wouldn't such frequent high current draw(sink) feed noise to the Vcc? Have anyone experimented with that? I'm using an ADC in my system with multiplexed leds and wondering if I shouldn't add a parallel capacitor with each LED?
62mA for all LEDs lit up is about what I would expect. At any point there are only 8 leds going, which is about <8mA per LED.
The PIC output pin sink driver is a NFET with similar properties to any NFET that you would use in a PSU design etc, Rds-on and they are really rated for average power disipation so you can run quite a high current IF it is a low duty cycle.
Just because Microchip are conservative (and have to guarantee their products) they like to rate them with the convenient "absolute max current" figures. But in reality they are a power FET like any other type.
Juts watch out for the new "shrunken die" PICs have much smaller and weaker output FETs than the old large die chips. If you look in the electrical specs in the datasheet your PIC will be one of these 2 types;
Max current pin=25mA, max for ALL ports 200mA (old PIC with large FETs)
Max current pin=25mA, max for all ports 90mA (new shrunken PIC with weak FETs)
The old large die has bigger FETs on bigger silicon with more heat dissipation, larger tracks, lower Rds-on of the FETs themselves etc etc. But the new smaller die PICs are cheaper and use less power.
The PIC power supply should be fine to source 62mA (max) pulsed, i've got some 22uF tantalums for the PIC power pins to use for PIC direct multiplexing. Don't expect a 0.1uF cap to do the job.
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