+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 5 of 5

Thread: Interference Patterns

  1. #1
    Banned crashsite Bad
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    724

    Default Interference Patterns

    In electronics, one of the early things you learn is that non-linear mixing of two frequencies will yield new frequencies (related by sum and difference values of the original frequencies). That's your basic heterodyning. Linear mixing does not produce these new frequencies. In fact, a measure of the quality of the linearity of a device (such as an audio amplifier) is to input two frequencies and then measure how much (preferably, how little) of the sum and difference frequencies are present.

    The ear has a non-linear (logarithmic) response and thus while we think we are hearing pure, dulcent tones, what we are really haring is a distorted caterwalling of noise. Our brains just tell us that it's beautiful music. But, there are times when we do hear "other frequencies". When tuning a guitar and a string is fretted so it produces the same pitch as another string and the two strings are plucked together, if the tuning is off just slightly, you can hear the beat note as a very low frequency variation.

    Radio and audio "follow the rules" and we can fairly easiy relate the theory to the observed result.

    The eye also has a logarithmic response but, I have to question if the interference patterns we often see are actually related to that. These would be the patterns seen when looking through two screens or fabrics or fence slats or any other objects that have regular, mathematically related spacings of their elements.

    The interference patterns seem to be related more to the "shadows" (perhaps a poor term) cast by one layer relative to the other and are observable equally well by our eyes, with their log response and cameras which typically have a linear response (especially film cameras...which is why a photograph and what we saw at the time are quite different).

    Are the visual interference patterns actually the result of "hetrodyning", requiring a non-linear device (such as our eyes) to see them or are they a completly different phenomena than say, RF and local oscillator mixing in a radio receiver?
    Last edited by crashsite; 3rd March 2008 at 01:09 PM.


  2. #2
    dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    6,029

    Default

    Are you talking about diffraction? I don't think that's heterodyning. That's waves forming constructive and desctructive interference. Even if you mixed light, I don't think we would be able to see a lot of it since we can only see limited frequencies of light.

  3. #3
    IČR Okay
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    87

    Default

    What you're describing are Moire (there's a diacritical over the e which I'm too lazy to figure out how to type) patterns. This is one type of aliasing, the same phEnomenon which causes wheels to appear to spin backwards in movies. It's similar to interference in some respects, but a distinctly different phenomenon which does not require nonlinear mixing.

    The eye doesn't see color by detecting the wavelength or frequency the way the ear does its job, it does so by detecting the energy level of the incoming photons. The interference effects we can see, such as the colors in a soap bubble, occur outside the eye and have nothing to do with linearity or the lack thereof in the eye.
    Last edited by IČR; 3rd March 2008 at 05:22 PM.

  4. #4
    dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent dknguyen Excellent
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    6,029

    Default

    This is what is said when they say the eye is more sensitive to magnitude than phase right? And the ear is more sensitive to phase than magnitude?

    I would what things would be like if we had ear arrays in the same way we have arrays of cones and rods. We'd have giant heads, that's for sure.

  5. #5
    Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent Hero999 Excellent
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    England
    Posts
    13,140

    Default

    The range of frequencies we can see is under one octive, the second harmonic of a bright 660nm red light is 330nm wich is ultravoillet so I don't think so.

    I do not answer private messages asking for help because no one else can: benefit from advice I may give or correct me if I'm wrong.

    Please ask on the open forum if you have a question and I'll be happy to help,
    if I know the answer.

+ Reply to Thread

Similar Threads

  1. pH transmitter electrical interference problem
    By sparkinite in forum General Electronics Chat
    Replies: 3
    Latest: 9th December 2006, 01:22 AM
  2. TV interference
    By mstechca in forum General Electronics Chat
    Replies: 6
    Latest: 11th July 2005, 12:02 PM
  3. CD player interference
    By jrz126 in forum Electronic Projects Design/Ideas/Reviews
    Replies: 9
    Latest: 8th October 2004, 11:43 AM
  4. Destructive Interference and Active Noise Control
    By Johnson777717 in forum General Electronics Chat
    Replies: 7
    Latest: 23rd June 2004, 06:26 AM
  5. Interference on sound card
    By grrr_arrghh in forum General Electronics Chat
    Replies: 17
    Latest: 27th May 2004, 06:54 PM

Tags for this Thread