I noticed the thread on this forum regarding the decline of Radioshack and other component shops and it reminded me of an artical I read awhile ago.
http://www.elecdesign.com/Articles/I...rticleID=15076

It's a good read but I wouldn't agree with the conclustion, electronic systems integration isn't really a hobby as there isn't a lot of skill involved in it, I would say it's more of a fascination. Either way, if electonics is gradually becomming less popular as a hobby it can't be a good thing for the economy in general.

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I think the decline has something to do with being able to repair your own consumer goods, most of which these days were never meant to be serviced or repaired, only replaced. A beginner has to tear apart several junk products, just to find a few of the parts need for even simple projects. No more free trials in this hobby, you have to be willing to buy parts. Radio Shack always sucked, but it was a local store where you could pick up a few parts, but not anymore.
We've all seen the posts requesting schematics, then comes the question of where to get the parts, then why doesn't it work... Hobbies are suppose to be a fun diversion.

Guessing most people veiw electronics as something best learned in a class room, and school work doesn't bring back the most pleasant memories...

 

I remember reading most of that article in my copy at work. Many good points there and here. I would add that the level of consumer electronics available at such low prices, with amazing features has done its bit also. Who wants to spend a couple hours building/programming something with a PIC that blinks a few LED's ?

You're friends will pause their video/MP3/phone long enough to say " um, like, is that all it does? ??"

Tinkering around with basic stuff has little appeal to many young people today, the level of electronic gadgetry makes it passe.

I left the consumer electronics repair business a quite a few years ago. Manuals cost more than the equipment. Parts? .. Not likely. $75 per hour to fix something that costs $19.95, not happening. There is very little anyone repairs nowadays, Home Depot caters to new construction, not repair. The old corner hardware store would sell one screw, and offer advice, they are gone too. Fix your own car... not without five figures worth of diagnostics gear. I can't even change the sparkplugs in mine without a means of tilting the engine forward. Serpantine belt?.. sorry, gotta remove an engine mount and support the engine/tranny on a special stand.

I think most products have so many features we consumers demand, have become so complicated, we have no hope of ever maintaining or "fiddling" with any of it anymore.

 

Maybe I am too young to truly know your definition of electronics hobbyist, but the only problem I see with ICs is things like BGAs (and you can do those yourself...if you're ultra dedicated).

The only board-level brick wall I've hit so far are cost-issues with PCBs with more than 4 layers, and BGAs (not doing them, but checking to see if they are done right...theoretically all you need is a skilley or oven or something).

Then again I hate tinkering or hacking with prexisting products. I prefer to buy the OEM parts and build everything with new parts- and because of that I could not really get started until just before university when I knew enough and had enough money to start. I definately see how not everybody could take the approach I do. I could have a car by now...but I don't. I tend not to make concessions due to cost in my projects (up to a point of course!)...if I wanted that I'd just go out and buy the thing I'm building.

If the author is using the definition of hobbyist as someone who experiments with electronics but doesn't follow the path to becoming an engineer...I can't say too much about that except that I know of no one who experiments with electronics that is not becoming an electrical or computer engineer (well I know one...but he's in engineering physics so it doesn't really count).

 

I think it would be just something as simple as the fact that most technology nowadays is produced in mass production and by robots...basically they are just to expensive to repair by hand.

The components have become so small that it really isn't practical to try and repair most things...like a broken motherboard.

 

I have to agree with Harvey. My first exposure to electronics was making old radios work again. It was the sort of that thing where you could have some success without knowing much. It got you interested.

The kids growing up today are surrounded by high tech. Instead of inspiring them it seems to be turning them off. Many seem to be technophobic.

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As a 39 year old hobbyist, (without any formal training in any programming language) I also tend to find it difficult to "learn" new things, especially when they seem to become more and more technologically advanced. Where are the days that you could build a car alarm with two 555's and have the same functionality as a µController today?

Now, if you don't have a PC, and other programming equipment etc. you'd be better off watching Discovery channel's "How it's made" and silently wish you knew more

 

hi,
I think its a case of constantly keeping upto date outside your normal working environment.
Many facts/figures and technical knowledge of a particular piece of equipment you have gained, when working within a company
will quickly go out of date, its application specific.

I find the electronics/physics/mechanics knowledge I gained at college
stills holds true and useful today as it did then, basics/fundamentals rarely change.

Its important that you have a good basic knowledge of electronic principles and also the ability to know where to find the information you require and have the background knowledge to decypher it in order to solve the problem,
you cannot be a specialist in all fields of electronics.

With regard to programming, like many I taught myself using the Z80 series of CPU's, as new devices PLA's/PIC's became available
it was a easy transition to programming these devices.

I think most of us started out as electronic hobbyists, caught the bug, and wanting a deeper understanding of the technology.

IMO 'learning' is a subject that can be 'learnt'.
If you consider the act of learning, there are many techniques that can improve how successful you are in retaining and recalling.
If you find it diffcult to learn, perhaps you are going about learning in the wrong way, its probably not the subject matter.

I'm in my 75th year and I still make an effort to keep my electronics knowledge upto date.
There is an old saying, 'use it or loose it'.

Regards

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"Good enough is Perfect"

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Bill's: www.blueroomelectronics.com/

 

I just got started in the hobby as a result of a job I got just over a year ago. I used to be a DSP guy in school, but got an electronics job out of college. I couldn't imagine being successful at this hobby without the schooling I've had, or the tools I now have at my work, or the money I have because of my engineering employment. Asking someone to learn discrete design, microcomputer programming & interfacing, and PCB design is a huge undertaking that hardly anyone will do without a lot of previous knowledge (ie a degree or work experience) and proper tools at their disposal.

 

I have several other hobbies, and I can see that electronics isn't really something that would appeal to those with no previous experience. Most hobbies you can usually dive in and start building the very first weekend. You can't just grab a schematic and a kit, although have seen some pretty detailed instructions that most anyone should be able to follow. You need to learn to solder properly, bad connections and too much heat, will surely be cause for failure. Need to associate the symbols on the schematic, to the physical parts, know how to read the values, and the pin assignments. Most transistors aren't labeled, nor are the pins the same for different parts.

For me, I started taking broken stuff apart before I start classes in high school. Got a few books at the local Public Library, magazines like Radio-Electronics, so I knew a few things before I got into all the boring theory stuff. Mostly I just wanted to build stuff, probably why I never pursued it as a career.

 

Let me raise my hand as a hobbyist and give some personal perspective. I simply cannot remember a time when science and airplanes were not my top two interests. I grew up in Los Angeles post-WWII. RC models were in their infancy. Availability of ready-made systems was limited and cost was high. The 1953 cost of a typical, single-channel receiver was $20 to $25 USD. That $20-receiver would be equivalent to $155 today. Today, you can still get very good receivers with far greater performance for around $20. In the 1950's we had to build much of our own equipment. Even as a grade schooler, I did that too. Thus, I was introduced to electronics as a hobbyist out of necessity. I went on to a profession in science that had almost nothing to do with electronics, but I remained a hobbyist.

I now have children and grandchildren. They are no different than we were at similar ages. So, why aren't they following similar paths into the hobby? Here are some reasons that come to my mind: 1) There is no necessity for them to make gadgets and toys; 2) Costs for ready-made electronic items are almost trivial; 3) We had almost unrestricted access to components, chemicals, and other building blocks; and 4) We have moved on technologically. Those "reasons" are not necessarily causes for lament. Etching a PCB and wiring two, TO-3-cased transistors together to make a flip-flop is not particularly relevant today.

The challenge in sustaining the hobby seems to be how to instill the desire to understand, to experiment, and to fix, instead of reboot. We as parents may have erred in getting too involved. Time for tinkering and failure was limited. However, in my immediate family, the outcome for the younger generation has been no different from my generation in terms of success. It is just that what they are doing is different, and their hobbies today are different.

They may come back to electronics, and maybe some of our conceptions that hobbyists need to start young is wrong. As pointed out by speakerguy79, he started after college.

One of the really great things about this site is the openness and patience of real experts in helping hobbyists like myself and others even less experienced.

I do disagree on the need for formal training and lots of equipment. I had no formal training, except for physics as I got older. A DVM/multimeter is enough to get started. A cheap oscilloscope is the other tool I had, which was built from a Knight kit (now long dead). Today, I do not have much more equipment than that, except I recently added a signal generator and an LC meter. Both new additions were only slightly more than $100 each. John

 

I had a subscription to Popular Electronics when I was in high school during the early 70's. Pages were full of info and fun projects. It was educational and inspirational.

From the viewpoint of joe public.

It is hard so I will not do it.

I have to agree with Erick in regards to use it or loose it. When you give up on learning.... you give up part of you mind?

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Junebug USB PIC programmer kit., USB Bit Wacker, 3v0's Homepage
The 15 Minute Printed Circuit Board! (+drill time)

 

It all starts with the kids parents.
Most kids these days, can't spend more than 5 minutes on something before becoming bored/uninterested. Some say kids suffer ADD(?). I think its a bunch of bull****.

Many kids are not at all disciplined (parents fault) and have everything given to them on a silver platter (again -parents) so why in the world would any of them try to stay interested in electronic tinkering?

One thing that is going for us though.. toys these days stink. Too much plastic with no real "features" because its too expensive or regarded as too dangerous...

 

day by day increasing number of TV channels........Video games.....etc are keeping kids away from physical activites. Regarding repair, devices are becoming smaller and smaller day by day along with fall in cost........SMD componentsare hard to replace and people think why to go for repair......when newer and better models are available!!!!!!!!

 

I get ask my opinion at work occasionally if something is worth getting repaired (usually leading upto whether or not I can fix it). The repair shops seem to charge $50-70, just to have a 'technician' open it up and take a look. Add in parts and labor, and it's usually a better idea just buy a new one. I very rarely let myself get talked into checking these things out myself. I know I don't have the experience for major surgery. Sometimes it sounds like something very simple, and I don't mind helping out.

A lot of the gadgets kids might want to build, are readily availiable and pre-assembled, mom and dad have a credit card (5 or 6 actually...), and usually not so expensive.

Don't see a lot of kids working these days. Child labor laws, too many perverts running around free (anybody ever check the sex offender website run by local sheriff's office?). I never got an allowance, or paid to do my chores. There many operatunities in the neighborhood. If I wanted something, I had to earn the money myself. Every penny had a tangible value, and was careful on how it was spent. Still the same way, I do the research, find what best suits my needs, and the best price. The most expensive isn't usually the best quality (logo price), nor paying for a lot of extra fancy features, which for the most part will never be used.

The kids that do come here looking to build circuits, usually choose 'Simple Shocker', 'Stun Gun', or 'FM transmitter'. Might be worthwhile to setup a section for beginners, and add links to simple projects that go into painful details, good pictures, and everything a complete novice might need to build successfully. I see them occasionally, but usually looking for something else, and don't pay them much thought.