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Old 16th June 2009, 09:01 AM   #1
Post How would I measure Power Factor?

I'm working on a Digital Wattmeter project, where the wattmeter is plugged to the mains, and an appliance is plugged to the wattmeter.

My question is, is there a way to measure Power Factor accurately?

EDIT:
I have heard of a Power Factor IC, which conveniently measures the power factor when connected. However, I could not seem to come across it.

Last edited by Viann; 16th June 2009 at 09:06 AM.
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Old 16th June 2009, 11:35 AM   #2
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You need to measure both the voltage waveform and current waveform (since you are making a wattmeter you would be doing this anyway) and compare the difference in phase. The power factor is the proportional difference between the two.

By the way - you can buy a wattmeter that works like that and measures power factor for $20. The "Kill-a-watt".

Last edited by duffy; 16th June 2009 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 16th June 2009, 04:03 PM   #3
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Since I cannot use an osilloscope, what would you recommend I use though, to measure the difference in phase?

And sadly, where I live, there is no "kill-a-watt".
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Old 16th June 2009, 04:06 PM   #4
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You can often find a kill-a-watt on eBay. Many sellers ship worldwide. You haven't indicated your location so it's hard to say.
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Old 16th June 2009, 04:38 PM   #5
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There we go.

Anyway, the purpose is building a digital wattmeter, sort of one like the "kill-a-watt" meter. It would be fantastic if the schematic of said meter is readily available, that would really help with information.

If not, I would still like to know how to accurately measure Power Factor without the help of an oscilloscope.
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Old 16th June 2009, 04:41 PM   #6
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Going to be difficult without a scope. Are you using a microcontroller?
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Old 16th June 2009, 04:48 PM   #7
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Yes, a PIC16F877A.

I will be interfacing the ACS712 Hall Effect Sensor with it to obtain the Voltage and Current reading.

Last edited by Viann; 16th June 2009 at 04:50 PM.
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Old 16th June 2009, 04:52 PM   #8
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Besides the phase method, you can measure the apparent power going to the load, which is the product of volts * amps ... and then measure the watts to the load, and take the ratio of these two quantities. .... If you are capable of taking these measurements.
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Old 16th June 2009, 06:32 PM   #9
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I've used the ACS712 before, it's great for reading current, but it doesn't read voltage.
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Old 16th June 2009, 07:29 PM   #10
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You could use an energy measurement IC such as one of these Energy Measurement | Analog to Digital Converters | Analog Devices.
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Old 17th June 2009, 02:21 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by user_88 View Post
Besides the phase method, you can measure the apparent power going to the load, which is the product of volts * amps ... and then measure the watts to the load, and take the ratio of these two quantities. .... If you are capable of taking these measurements.
I might be wrong, but isn't the product of (Volts * Amps) True Power?


Quote:
Originally Posted by duffy View Post
I've used the ACS712 before, it's great for reading current, but it doesn't read voltage.
Isn't it the other way round?
i.e. the ACS712 receives current and outputs voltage?



Once again, I might be wrong.


Quote:
Originally Posted by crutschow View Post
You could use an energy measurement IC such as one of these Energy Measurement | Analog to Digital Converters | Analog Devices.
I'll have a look up on that.
Thank you.

Last edited by Viann; 17th June 2009 at 02:24 PM.
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Old 17th June 2009, 03:55 PM   #12
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It OUPUTS voltage but it READS current.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Viann View Post
I will be interfacing the ACS712 Hall Effect Sensor with it to obtain the Voltage and Current reading.
So it doesn't READ voltage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Viann
Isn't it the other way round?
i.e. the ACS712 receives current and outputs voltage?
Yes, but you said you were trying to OBTAIN voltage, which that doesn't do.
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Old 17th June 2009, 04:01 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viann View Post
I might be wrong, but isn't the product of (Volts * Amps) True Power?
For DC. For AC the product of volts times amps is apparent power. The product of volts times amps times the cosine of the phase angle between them is true power. For example a capacitor will draw AC current when placed across an AC source but it will draw no real power from the source since the current and voltage are 90 degrees out of phase.
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Last edited by crutschow; 17th June 2009 at 04:02 PM.
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Old 24th June 2009, 06:44 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crutschow View Post
For DC. For AC the product of volts times amps is apparent power. The product of volts times amps times the cosine of the phase angle between them is true power. For example a capacitor will draw AC current when placed across an AC source but it will draw no real power from the source since the current and voltage are 90 degrees out of phase.
I see, thanks for clearing it up crutschow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by duffy View Post
Yes, but you said you were trying to OBTAIN voltage, which that doesn't do.
Ah, I'm terribly sorry, I misunderstood how the ACS712 functions.

With that note, is there a way to measure voltage from the mains connecting to an appliance?
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Old 24th June 2009, 06:49 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viann View Post
With that note, is there a way to measure voltage from the mains connecting to an appliance?
A voltmeter.
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