Originally Posted by HiTech

The system works well for those who work to constructively support the system. Our capitalist system isn't flawless, but I am one citizen that doesn't want government deciding such things for me and my family. I don't need the help of my village to raise my family, nor do I need government controlling my various insurance policies and other aspects of my life.

The system SUCKS! US health insurance costs $220/wk on the average, and then you still have to pay $30 for doctors, $30 for meds, $1500 for operations, %50 for durable medical, and STILL there are 60 MILLION people UNINSURED!

What you should think about is how much you need multi-million dollar CEOs of insurance and drug companies. Do you not care what happens to those around you? Or are you one of those ultraconservative re-poop-licans that lives off the misery of those around you? Brainwashed perhaps?

I have first hand experience with the efficiency of the "system"... My wife has more health problems than most death bedridden elderly in nursing homes.

I have a "payment plan" for her insulin pump... ok I suppose that qualifies as durable medical, but I have trouble with the rest of the bills already. But the pump supplies? I have to pay out $100 per month, mostly for the insertion sets and reservoirs (they call a three day life cycle on a disposable "durable"), and then something like 5 meds with copays every month. And that is BEFORE the doctors copays, and hopefully her back and everything else holds out so we do not get hit with a $1500 surgery bill.

How is that being covered? The "insurance industry", only covers those who are healthy, and promptly drops anyone that actually starts to require attention- ever hear their favorite term "uninsurable"? How about "lifetime benefit limit"?

The only time they come even close to what they should be doing is when the gov steps in and orders them to with decrees like "you will NOT refuse coverage to diabetics" or fill in the blank.

http://www.pnhp.org/ has a lot of excellent studies and sources on just how pathetic our coverage is. The thing you are neglecting to see is that we pay 3-4 times PER CAPITA, for a FRACTION of the "capita" to actually be covered even minimally. Since you are healthy and have a decent job you do not see what is actually happening, or simply do not care.

Dan

Chill SV, this is the Chit-Chat forum afterall. Threads do morph off-topic at times.

Ubergeek63

I'm assuming that you reside in the US? What you posted is well true of a good many US citizens and that's most unfortunate. I worked in the healthcare industry for over 10 years, noting how insurance companies made the greatest impact on providers and patients. Like 3Vo stated, the middlemen need to be removed. They are nothing but high-paid leeches that promise to control/administer (read as "rule") healthcare and how and who it gets applied to.

In my situation (and this may seem rather cold and brash, but it's not intentional nor a flame) I have put forth a continued great effort to make myself a very desirable employee saught by large organizations who provide generous benefits packages. Upon my retirement I realize that these benefits will dwindle and therefore, during my tenure with an employer, I save & invest wisely to be more self-sustaining during my retirement years. The system works for those who put forth the effort and determination... in other words, those who work hard reap the fruits of their labor. It's only fair... or is it, especially when the government steps in and unfairly slides the balance of responsibility, heavily taxing the successful and the motivated?

The squirrel that doesn't store food for the coming winter is left to deal with the bitter cold or, leech off the others who prepared properly. A friend of mine is very capable of working a job but chooses not to for various excuses. Thusly he somehow qualified for a state medical access card and a small amount of SSI income. If he applied himself effectively. he'd enjoy a better lifestyle than the present one, always talking about where his next dollar is going to come from. Meanwhile, my tax money helps to provide him those basic entitlements that truly should be awarded to the "transitional needy"... a hand up, not a hand out on a regular basis.

If you look closely at HID lighting systems in some cars, you will see HV warning labels. This is to inform and hopefully alert emergency response rescue workers during a vehicle accident. There have been some cases where an emergency crewman ended up worse off than the crash victim from HV exposure in HID systems!!

Originally Posted by HiTech

I worked in the healthcare industry for over 10 years, noting how insurance companies made the greatest impact on providers and patients. Like 3Vo stated, the middlemen need to be removed. They are nothing but high-paid leeches that promise to control/administer (read as "rule") healthcare and how and who it gets applied to.

So what about a system that was publicly funded and privately run. ie: The insurance company is a non-profit government agency but hospitals and clinics are still privately run. The problem now is that the HMOs are a strong lobby group in the USA and will be very hard to get rid of.

Healthcare insurance companies spawned HMO's!!!! The HMO is the economical solution for the working patsy and to small companies with financial limits to their employee benefits. Bottom line to healcare coverage is "marketing". Insurance companies lobbied together years ago, established some industry standards and guidelines and forced their hand upon healthcare providers and their customers. Hillary Clinton back in 1992 certainly escalated industry-wide fears with her debacle. How easily people forget her antics and to think she got elected as a Senator and worse yet a presidential candidate!!! That's scary!

BTW, what healthcare insurance providers are government agencies? Medicare/Medicaid? Many are for profit organizations. I believe some may even be publically traded like HumanaOne and Coventry. I stumbled upon this interesting read: http://www.pnhp.org/news/2007/march/...faction_wi.php

Originally Posted by HiTech

BTW, what healthcare insurance providers are government agencies?

In BC, Canada, it is the Provincial government. It basically collects heath care premiums and taxes and uses that to fund hospitals, doctors, etc. Most provinces in Canada fund health care directly from taxes. The Federal government also contributes. We pay more taxes, but we get more services such as relatively cheap medical care, etc. Clinics and doctor's offices are private and covered under the government plan, but most hospitals are publicly run as well.

I stumbled upon this interesting read

Yes, when you add shareholders to the mix, it gets even worse.

When I say publicly run I mean government run. I'm not talking about publicly traded companies.

In Ontario now, there is a health care premium charged on the income tax form. Rich people pay a lot and poor people pay nothing.
Most hospital procedures cost nothing to citizens and to the millions of refugees who come to Canada.

Here in the lower states, we have illegal immigrants mysteriously receiving entitlements (medical care, driver's license, financial assistance, food stamps, etc.) that are meant to temporarily assist those legal US citizens who are the "transitional needy"... by that I mean those who may have been laid off from their jobs, temporarily in-between jobs, or suffered a catastrophy, etc. It's supposed to be a hand up not a hand out. Government sponsored medical assistance provides pretty good healthcare coverage... often better than some private plans that the working class has to pay for!

Originally Posted by HiTech

BTW, what healthcare insurance providers are government agencies? Medicare/Medicaid? Many are for profit organizations. I believe some may even be publically traded like HumanaOne and Coventry. I stumbled upon this interesting read: http://www.pnhp.org/news/2007/march/...faction_wi.php

Quite an informative site, isn't it?

Certainly Medicare/Medicaid.

Here is another interesting one: http://www.pnhp.org/publications/payingnotgetting.pdf

Just think... 70 MILLION people could be insured just with the overhead caused by the insurance industry! 350B in direct overhead in the insurance industry and 350B in the health care industry caused by insurance industry paper shuffling. All that waste and they still deny heart transplants to the ones that are lucky enough not to be among the 45 million uninsured!

[QUOTE][moe in wichita ks
some states have laws that high voltage cars have to have labels showing the high voltage lines. for the emergency workers.
also is the high voltage going to get the poeple in the car in a crash?
/QUOTE]
I think my most shocking experience was when I was
installing the controller on my powered wheelchair
and forgot to route the cable on the outside.
I leaned back and WHAM! the chair had scissored the cable in a shower of sparks and smoke!
The wires had fused together in a big blob but I pulled the plug before it started a fire.
Sadly an expensive lesson...altho still using the same 12 year old gel-cell batteries,they actually still hold a good charge