Running car on water IS a scam... but not running a car on HHO. Consider the HH & the O. The HH is a volatile gas is it not (Hint - Hindenburg). And as for the O, oxygen is the best accelerate, is it not? And the SCIENCE that is in the physics books, shows us the ideal mixture of the H & O is in fact 2:1 (2 H's to 1 O). If you are a God fearing person and read the good book, check out Job 38:22-23. From His mouth to our ears, it is in the grand plan!!! And considering the times we live in, this alone should be all the proof one needs. But many say they are, yet they really are not! (Hmmm, I wonder if THAT will get me kicked off???)

And when the day comes that HHO IS main stream, you may want to change your user name, you will be embarrassed for crying wolf so loud.

 

As I was doing the haying today I thought about a few explanations as to how The adding HHO to an engines intake air may possibly give actual real mileage and power increases.

Its a known fact that by changing an emission compliant engines A/F ratio from the stoichiometric approximate of 14.4:1 to a approximate 12.6:1 there is a real honest increase in power and fuel efficiency and also due to the added fuel the ignition timing can be slightly advanced aiding in further power and fuel economy. Ask any old timer who worked on carbonated engines years ago. they will confirm this or any off road racer can as well.

Another possible reason is the added oxygen increases the burn rate of gasoline vapor. This is also a confirmable method of boosting the apparent power of a gasoline by oxidizing it faster and will also reduce fuel consumption simply by getting the fuel to give off its energy faster.

Hydrogen boosting gasoline vapor has been shown to also change the burn characteristics of gasoline slightly and can aid in increasing the octane equivalent of the fuel and will allow more advanced ignition timing also which does improve the burn efficiency and relative power output per unit of gasoline used.

Back in the old days it was also common with larger farm machinery engines to purposely add watter to the gasoline in a specifically metered amount to gain power and get heavily worked engines to run cooler at the same time. Most of the old two cylinder John Deere tractors had this as a factory instaled system years ago. Its also well known by off road racers and and is sometimes used on high performance diesel engine applications as well.

So does adding water gas really make it possible to increase fuel mileage? Its very plausible and I will not give it a flat out no being I regularly do some things that seem to defy common logic and supposed expert explanation.
I wont say yes until I have fully done it myself though! Just a solid maybe.
And it has brought out enough curiosity on my part to likely justify personal experimentation some day being I do have the materials and components to actually be able to do an honest scientific study of its effects.

After All I do have a diesel that runs on 100% used oil and numerous large three phase motor driven devices that run strait off of single phase at there full running power and efficiency with only a few added passive components. So why not try and add a water powered engine to the collection as well.

__________________
"Issue a general safety warning. Then look the other way and allow stupidity the chance to eliminate itself." -- tcmtech
"Those who can, Will. Those who can't, will achieve positions of power over those who can and then promptly stop them." -- tcmtech
"Your impossibility may just be my day to day routine." -- tcmtech

 

Saw it many times. But still I only take my own research as the truth. There are too many people out there claiming it does work to some degree and that draws my attention.

I have never been one to take other persons views of impossible as serious. I am skeptical but I can not dismiss something until I have proven it to myself that its all foolishness and junk.

And as I stated I will do the experiments in as scientific of fashion as possible if I choose to do them at all. I have the materials, the equipment to fashion the components, the knowledge of electrical and electronics devices, and the knowledge and hands on experience with internal combustion engines to be able to account for what does or does not happen.
If I do it and nothing happens I will state that nothing happened. But if something does... I am going to find out what caused it and why it so happens despite the present scientific opinions that it shouldn't work at all. And then I too will customize my design to fit my vehicles and give the dirty finger to the fuel companies a bit more than I do right now!

Sorry to disappoint but sometimes I just have to see what all the fuss is about my self for good or bad! And I do love a good scientifically implausible challenge now and then.

Besides, once the universe rotated around the earth, the world was flat, machines couldn't fly, and the sound barrier couldn't be broken by anything large enough a human could fit into! And absolutely everybody knew all of that was scientifically true and unquestionable facts!

__________________
"Issue a general safety warning. Then look the other way and allow stupidity the chance to eliminate itself." -- tcmtech
"Those who can, Will. Those who can't, will achieve positions of power over those who can and then promptly stop them." -- tcmtech
"Your impossibility may just be my day to day routine." -- tcmtech

 

This thread could have gone somewhere good. I personally would have liked to see pictures of his electrolysis setup, schematics of his control unit etc and maybe people could have commented on making it better, more efficient plate clearing, electrolyte circulation, higher efficiency electronics, electroliser heat recycling etc. Hydrogen IS a legitimate energy storage medium and there is a lack of legit hydrogen research going on by people who actually have the skills.

But the thread immediately headed out into left field talking about JFK and Meyers and government conspiracies etc etc. And so the people who have the skills will walk away accomplishing nothing and claiming "hydrogen is a scam" and the people who don't have the skills will keep trying to make the world a better place but hindered by burning their fingers on their smoking output caps.

Sigh.

 

I get the sense that the conspiracies are the OP's primary interest anyway.

Hydrogen is a legitimate way to store and transport energy, and it's true that we could be doing more research on it. However, using Hydrogen or "HHO" in the field as a way of fooling an emission control system without regard to pollution impact is questionable at best.

I would buy into the Government Conspiracy that they are manipulating the cars we drive, to their own goals.
I have observed major improvements in air quality in just the past 30 years. I don't want to give any of that back.

__________________
de KI6RWX

 

I did say in my post above to keep this above board and no sooner the skeptics have moved to try and de-rail this entire thread. I will leaves things be for now and any further non topical posts( you know what I mean) the op will wish they didnt post.

The whole point about separating the forum was to let RE and Alternate energy be separate and mainly to stop the entire forum becoming a joke. If some members just want to continue trashing this part of the forum then maybe they shouldn'y bother posting in here.


Regards Bryan

__________________
" The only way to avoid human error is to avoid the use of humans"

 

Mr RB I'm like you I would like to see it to like shown some pictures it would help maybe a circuit or two would be good.

There is power in water but it takes power to get it out that's not free.

Now maybe we could make a nao power generator
to brake down the water maybe.

__________________
Burt
http://mybe80be.com
http://stores.shop.ebay.com/mybe80be__W0QQ_armrsZ1

 

Bill I don't no how to post it. I didn't no where to attache my files to the forum but I give you this Alternative Energy research by Zero Fossil Fuel - Hydrogen, Solar, Wind LoL that site don't show how the OP made his
cel or what ever you call it.
Why can't people that say they want help post what there taking about.

They have the pwm part but what making your capacitor go bad could be in the cel

__________________
Burt
http://mybe80be.com
http://stores.shop.ebay.com/mybe80be__W0QQ_armrsZ1

 

I've read too many of them and I don't waste my time with them any longer. I know it works, its been working for me. That's all I care about. As for the matter of FREE. I know what you are saying, unity or over unity. No claims to that here. Your talking about the amount of energy used to make the HHO. Whatever the numbers are, I just know HHO makes my cars and trucks run better, live longer, and most importantly, SAVES MONEY!!!

For circuits, the CCPWM in its most recent version can be found at Web hosting, domain name registration and web services by 1&1 Internet. And for photos, I have a few here somewhere. But not nearly as many, and as varied, as you will find if you just Google HHO. Tons of videos as well so you can see the truth. I know some of them are making outlandish claims, but that is mostly due to their ignorance, and they do in fact show these systems working.

 

I will not argue with you or anyone else. There have been problems getting HHO to work properly. The constant current PWM has been one of the many need answers. And that answer needed some help, ergo, I asked for help here, and got it. So I once again thank those who have provided the help. As for you sir, believe what you wish. I seem to be spinning my wheels with you and that stops now.

 

Your efforts would be most welcome should you get involved with this. Your electronics expertise especially. And if you do begin to play with this, you will soon become enthralled with it, at least this is my impression from the few threads we have shared. And who knows, it may be you that does in fact come up with something that exceeds unity which so many people seem fixated upon. Then I would be very thrilled to be the one who introduced you to HHO.

And considering the agencies and companies I have cited that are using or doing research into HHO, one would have to think these people are not wasting their monies on fruitless challenges. At least the reasonable thinker would suppose. So, as I pointed out in another reply in this thread, I will not get sucked into any arguments as to the merits of this technology. Again, it works for me and my wallet and we are both very happy with this result.

And I couldn't agree more, I don't take others claims, for or against, with too many things. I must try them myself and if they work, I get on board. When they do not work, I will just as quickly decry my experience, but, submit my results for review in case my efforts may trigger someone else to find a way to make "it" work, whatever "it" is.

And the next "scientific truth" to be shattered, in the list you cited, is the speed limit imposed upon light! Heck, Hollywood already figured it out...

 

Actually, if you look closely at the web site, you will find that ZFF makes, and continues to make, videos of ALL his work, and not just his electronics. This guy is an educated researcher and he has taught me much just by watching his work. I have tried to communicate with him, but he apparently does not like to reply too often & I can imagine why, he must get hundreds of emails daily from people like myself. He is up to around 170 of these videos to date, perhaps a bit more, I haven't been there for a while.

And your lack of spending time on that site is exactly what I would expect of you. You do not want to know the truth, so you decry and criticize in ignorance. Dig deeper, you may find a truth that one day changes your life, and not necessarily in regards to HHO.

As for the problem with the PWM. There have been a couple gentlemen here who have helped to resolve this issue, which is the reason I joined this forum. I do not want to try to convince anyone about this. I was married toooooo looooong to a pessimistic personality, I have that merit badge ∫η §ρΔΦξ§ & on t-shirts of may colors - thank you very much..., and I refuse to waste my time with such efforts. If you are not here to help, then please do not waste mine, nor others here that have helped me. Besides, as I understand it, this is not the place for such debates and you get way off subject.

It works for me and my wallet (...heard something like this recently as well...hmmmm). That's what I am concerned with.

Good day...

 

I just read a post from the moderator and I agree with him, so this is the LAST TIME I will get off topic here.

I have no need to prove to anyone anything. If your ignorant bliss is your happy little world, enjoy!!!

I have pointed to numerous resources for designs. You investigate for yourself.

How do you now if I am rich or not? Do you know my ex-wife ??? Besides, I measure wealth in values that are lost on you if they are not $$$'s. And even there, define rich. Never mind, this stops now.

Eventually many people will own such designs. Most of these will be intelligent, reasoning folks, unlike some others we know.

What's a Nobel Prize....

 

I have been in forums other than this one in the past & understand there are rules to go by. I originally asked for help, not intending to get into any "debates" over any issue. It is difficult for me to ignore slams and trying to get them out of the way seems fruitless in this case. From this point forward, I will vow to STAY ON TOPIC and disregard these people.

I do appreciate this forum and wish to continue here in good faith and on topic with only the truth. This is not the place for such debates. And there is a reason I do not join any forum that debates anything, stupid people make me laugh too much, and I just have to waste my time with them.

 

The thing is some people dont care about how much money something will make them. If I do get a system built and in the highly unlikely event it does produce large amounts of mechanical power with very little fuel used I am not going to be shooting my mouth off about it in order to make millions but rather quietly using it to better my own life with as little attention drawn to me as possible.

First realistic theory is that if it does work I am building a system of co- generation gen sets and then be selling power back to the utilities with it if the operating cost outlay is even only slightly less than the sale of electricity is worth.
Second is that I would be setting up a number of over the road trucks to do goods transport trucking. Cutting the cost of fuel out of trucking would give me a substantial advantage over any other trucking business.

As far as the over unity claims one very simple fact always seem to get overlooked. The fact we are surrounded by incredible amounts of naturally occurring forms of energy already. By tapping into them that does not disobey any laws of science.

Here is an example of not so over unity but still could count if all forms of energy are not taken into account.
If you took a your vehicles alternator and left out the mechanical input aspect of it what you would see is a device that takes a small electrical current and turns it into a large one. Its over unity in the electrical sense provided you dont account for the other 'mechanical input' part of the equation.

Thats how much of the over unity claims can in fact be dismissed and still work within the laws of science. The extra energy is coming from a less known or simply overlooked commonly occurring source.

Just a theory.

__________________
"Issue a general safety warning. Then look the other way and allow stupidity the chance to eliminate itself." -- tcmtech
"Those who can, Will. Those who can't, will achieve positions of power over those who can and then promptly stop them." -- tcmtech
"Your impossibility may just be my day to day routine." -- tcmtech